Complete Pin Shed - On A Budget (ish)

[DanLewell]

how much space should you allow for each pin width ways. Back box is about 74cm ish. (is a backbox on a widebody game any bigger? ) you need to leave a bit of room to nudge though without them hitting each other. so for 4 pins, is 3m 20cm enough space, or would you allow more?

Im planning something like this, so I want to work out how long the wall with 4 pins will be so I can work out the length of the longer wall to keep under 15m2.

Also, the roof will over hang to create a porch area, does anyone know if that will count as part of the 15m or is it only footprint of the building on the floor that counts?

 

[Jsyjamie]

how much space should you allow for each pin width ways. Back box is about 74cm ish. (is a backbox on a widebody game any bigger? ) you need to leave a bit of room to nudge though without them hitting each other. so for 4 pins, is 3m 20cm enough space, or would you allow more?

Im planning something like this, so I want to work out how long the wall with 4 pins will be so I can work out the length of the longer wall to keep under 15m2.

Also, the roof will over hang to create a porch area, does anyone know if that will count as part of the 15m or is it only footprint of the building on the floor that counts?

View attachment 37655

When doing sketch ups of mine was allowing 80cm so 3.20m internal measurement should be fine.

The overhand won't count as it is only the internal floor area as the porch is classed like decking which doesn't need any permission.

Hope that helps

 

[stoptap]

Was just thinking of my jungle and what I could put down there for a pinshack. I was thinking of a 20 x 10 ft shed. Would that work for 6 or 7 machines?

Welcome To The Jungle !

I have a jungle at the end of my garden too. I have a half brick shed behind my garage. If I clear the jungle, build a new shed for bikes and whatnot I could demolish the old shed, extend the garage backwards and get another 3 games in !

 

[newdos]

Here is the next episode of the saga!
Spoken to architect, structural engineer and planning officer and the result is that the two walls will have to be fireproofed and I need an SER certificate for the base which is mental.
So that is happening and should be sorted next week.
I had this week off but decided to go in to work yesterday because of the shed stopping, right? WRONG!
The old man said he would be putting a new bit of stud up in the ensuite we are remodeling but he lied.
This is what I came back to last night:
View attachment 37651
There were a few choice words from me, hopefully we don't have to rip any of it down.
Once I calmed down I had to admit it looks awesome!
Felt underlay down on the roof, added some bracing to the walls and first fix electrics in.
One double socket on each end wall, three on the front and four on the back. Fuse board on the right as you walk in the double doors. Two rows of four LED down lights inside and a row of four on the outside soffit at the front.
In work today so don't know what mad schemes the old man will be getting up to while I'm not there!
Job for the weekend, insulation!

wow man thats flying!!!!!!

 

[newdos]

can you get some pics inside the roof before anything else goes up - curious to see how its all fixed etc

Cheers

kev

 

[Jsyjamie]

can you get some pics inside the roof before anything else goes up - curious to see how its all fixed etc

Cheers

kev

Any good?

 

[Jsyjamie]

can you get some pics inside the roof before anything else goes up - curious to see how its all fixed etc

Cheers

kev

Dupe

 

[DRD]

Great progress

Could I ask how you formed the edges to the roof pls ? Is that just 4x2 screwed under the plywood roof ?

The older generation just did stuff differently. Indeed, they just did stuff. We of the EU/ Tony Blair Generation live in a society governed by evermore rules and state intervention. We adhere.

I went to a quiz in my village hall. Baking hot. No ventilation. Why ?

1. Kids balloons had become entangled in the three roof mounted ventilation fans. The Village Hall would not allow anyone to go up on ladders to remove them. Forget all the builders that own scaffold towers who do that sort of thing for a living. Health and Safety
2. The village hall would not allow the external fire doors to be opened. An officious committee member stationed himself close to them

So we all sat in there moaning and sweating.

Then two old ladies had just had enough. They got up, opened the doors. No-one dare criticise them as they are old. Problem solved.

 

[JMP]

I can understand the ladder thing but why not open fire doors?

Here is the next episode of the saga!

Ha ha, your Dad rocks ! Good news about treatment of the walls. What's the floor thing?

Also, for anyone needing planning permission for their shack, how long does it last once granted?

 

[DRD]

The doors are supposedly about noise control. The powers at be seem unable to discern between noisy events _ like the women's institute? V quiet ones like the quiz

 

[Jsyjamie]

Could I ask how you formed the edges to the roof pls ? Is that just 4x2 screwed under the plywood roof ?

Hopefully this picture should give you an idea.
The roof joists are 6x2 which rest on the front and back walls doubled up either side of the walls at the end. A 2x1 batten goes on the outside so that the roofers can fit the felt.

 

[Jsyjamie]

Ha ha, your Dad rocks ! Good news about treatment of the walls. What's the floor thing?

Also, for anyone needing planning permission for their shack, how long does it last once granted?

Ha-ha, I think the saying "there's a fine line between madness and genius" probably best describes my old man!

I need to have an engineer certify the pad stones so that's more money

Planning took about 6-8 weeks for me, once you have that you can crack on.

 

[Jsyjamie]

Didn't get much done this weekend as the weather was too good on Saturday and too crap on Sunday.

Insulated the floor with some Kingspan Therma Floor 150mm which I got free from work. This stuff is quite expensive and I probably wouldn't have used it if it wasn't a freebie!



I was two sheets short of doing the whole floor which was annoying. Easy stuff to work with but quite time consuming compared to just stuffing standard mineral fiber insulation like the type in your loft.


Also prepped the three windows for the front to go in this week, again freebies.

Hopefully the roofers should finish the roof and tyvek the outside of the shed over the next couple of days so we can fit the windows and it will be pretty much water tight.

 

[DRD]

Lots of people slag councils off. Cast doubts on the parentage of staff. Question the intelligence of staff etc etc

But be in no doubt. Councils are brilliant and I mean brilliant, grand master at chess brilliant, at demanding that homeowners spend small fortunes on surveys, professional reports, structural engineers, bat people

They spend other people's money faster than top end hookers in Monaco

 

[Anton]

You have to take into account that building control and planning are also there to protect everyday people to prevent rogue builders bodging extensions or building monster extensions without any thought for those around us. Unfortunately this instance of a large shed seems like they are going overboard. A shed is a temporary structure so should be viewed with slightly different rules. Clearly the structure has been built properly, so they should be viewing the regs with some realism. We found Reading council to be excellent when converting Victorian houses to flats. They couldn't me more helpful or realistic to the challenges we had. They would come out within 24hrs and then discuss routes and options to problems we faced.
If you end up with a mini hitler, which we did every now and again, we requested a change in building controller.

 

[DRD]

I was advised by mine that as I live about 400 yds from a church I need archaeologists present to make sure that foundations do not destroy valauable (unknown, no previous evidence of anything) artefacts. Throw in a traffic survey too, visibility splays etc. And then a noise survey. How about soil samples..

No wonder we have a housing crisis. All this cost renders it uneconomic to build starter homes and oap bungalows

 

[newdos]

Any good?
View attachment 37664

cheers man -was curious to see if you put any noggins in the roof space where the roof boards butt together - guess you dont need them ??

 

[newdos]

Out of interest what is underneath that kingspan in the floor? - is it just open to the elements and rodents etc or have you put something in the bottom first ?

Cheers

kev

 

[Jsyjamie]

Out of interest what is underneath that kingspan in the floor? - is it just open to the elements and rodents etc or have you put something in the bottom first ?

Cheers

kev

We attached some battens to the bottom of the joists so the insulation couldn't slip though over time. It is open to the elements underneath but it is stuffed in tight and silver backed.
The front of the shed will have the paving ramping up to it so that the porch is at the same level to help in getting bits in and out then the other edges will have the cladding running all the way down to ground level so it shouldn't be an issue....hopefully!

 

[newdos]

cool man - its looking very sweet!!!

 

[kevlar]

Isn't this finished yet?

 

[Jsyjamie]

Isn't this finished yet?

Give me a chance mate!
I was off last week so got loads done but it will mainly be weekends from now on.
The roofers should hopefully be finished the next couple of days and will have the outside Tyveked by the weekend so it will be watertight

 

[newdos]

Give me a chance mate!
I was off last week so got loads done but it will mainly be weekends from now on.
The roofers should hopefully be finished the next couple of days and will have the outside Tyveked by the weekend so it will be watertight

If you are looking for a cheaper but very nearly as good as kingspan for your wall insulation take a look at this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/280430084781?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

it works out a £2.63 sqm as opposed to kingspan at £6.94 sqM they also do it in 100mm batts for the roof space as well

Could be a no brainer!!

Cheers

kev

 

[Paul]

Problem is that it had no foil backing, so would be susceptable to moisture, which you will get between the inside and the outside in winder months if heated above outdoor temps..

 

[newdos]

Problem is that it had no foil backing, so would be susceptable to moisture, which you will get between the inside and the outside in winder months if heated above outdoor temps..

Surely not Paul as long as an air gap is present on the outside surface of the insulation - isn't that the whole point of the air gap so cold doesn't meet warm ?

Would you not expect the kingspan to do the same ie the foil would get very wet and run down to the floor timbers if there were no air gap?

I thought the foil was just there to protect the foam and make handling easier(and prevent it from getting wet if installed incorrectly)

Cheers

kev

 

[Jsyjamie]

If you are looking for a cheaper but very nearly as good as kingspan for your wall insulation take a look at this

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/280430084781?ssPageName=STRK:MESINDXX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1436.l2649

it works out a £2.63 sqm as opposed to kingspan at £6.94 sqM they also do it in 100mm batts for the roof space as well

Could be a no brainer!!

Cheers

kev

Funny you should say that Kev, I have a few packs of that exact stuff in the shed and was contemplating sticking it in the walls!

As Paul says Kingspan or similar would be better but I don't think it is essential.

I can get Kingspan TW50 from work for about £6/m2 so might go for that, still undecided...

 

[Paul]

Surely not Paul as long as an air gap is present on the outside surface of the insulation - isn't that the whole point of the air gap so cold doesn't meet warm ?

Would you not expect the kingspan to do the same ie the foil would get very wet and run down to the floor timbers if there were no air gap?

I thought the foil was just there to protect the foam and make handling easier(and prevent it from getting wet if installed incorrectly)

Cheers

kev

http://blog.kingspaninsulation.co.uk/use-foil-faced-insulation/

Apologies Kev - it seems it's for themal reasons and not for water, however having had some kingspan in water i would still argue to keep moisture away...

However, an interesting comment from their Chief Technical person in the comments of the article...

Our leading technical advisor, Naomi, has taken a look at this for you. Her reply is detailed below:

A foil faced product facing into an unventilated cavity does provide a lower emissivity value, which can add to the overall thermal performance of a construction. However, combining copious amounts of mineral wool at the horizontal ceiling level and insulating with rigid boards at the pitch can create problems with interstitial condensation. This can be made worse by having an unbreathable material above the rafters with no ventilation. As there are multiple factors to consider, it would be best to have a condensation risk analysis done by us to provide the best insulation option

 

[DRD]

It had to happen. We have hit condensation voodoo time

4 folk will yield 5 opinions

I would say that rocksil wool is truly vile as a material. Dust mask, goggles, overalls, gloves

 

[newdos]

It had to happen. We have hit condensation voodoo time

4 folk will yield 5 opinions

I would say that rocksil wool is truly vile as a material. Dust mask, goggles, overalls, gloves

Yes but when it is is solid compressed batts that will fit exactly between timbers its a doddle to use!!!

 

[newdos]

Funny you should say that Kev, I have a few packs of that exact stuff in the shed and was contemplating sticking it in the walls!

As Paul says Kingspan or similar would be better but I don't think it is essential.

I can get Kingspan TW50 from work for about £6/m2 so might go for that, still undecided...

Yeah thats the stuff and so much cheper for almost the same thermal properties and that's what is important here. And remember you are doing this on a budget LOL !!!!

Cheers

Kev