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John Wick by Stern

Well yes, but I thought you said bars are buying games or should be.
Pins are in bars. That can be buying a pin. Or having an operator run a pin.

The pin needs to be priced to make money for the operator. And the bartender/owner/parent company has to want a pin. Either way, there's a potentially untapped market in manufacturing new pins for locations that don't currently them.
 
Sure, those factors all have an impact - but they don’t explain how Jurassic Park LE cost me £10k just under five years ago, whereas John Wick LE would cost me £15.7k today.
Inflation would have taken the price in five years to around £12.9k, so with stern games there is something from stern to electro coin and the dealers that is being added to the price to get to fifteen. Not sure on five year old game prices from other manufacturers but I don’t think they have had this much more increase as stern games
 
Pins are in bars. That can be buying a pin. Or having an operator run a pin.

The pin needs to be priced to make money for the operator. And the bartender/owner/parent company has to want a pin. Either way, there's a potentially untapped market in manufacturing new pins for locations that don't currently them.
Just because pins are in bars doesn’t mean they make money or are played.

Any time pins are on site, there has always been pinheads trying to buy them cheaply. They often won’t put money in but will always try to buy
 
Coincidently I received a message from eu supplier today for John wick, prices offered in euro were

Pro 6980+vat = €8515/7320 gbp
Premium 8910+vat = €10870/9345 gbp
LE 12900 + vat = €15738/13530 gbp

Quite a markup on those prices in UK
which I guess is mainly down to electrocoin.
 
Coincidently I received a message from eu supplier today for John wick, prices offered in euro were

Pro 6980+vat = €8515/7320 gbp
Premium 8910+vat = €10870/9345 gbp
LE 12900 + vat = €15738/13530 gbp

Quite a markup on those prices in UK
which I guess is mainly down to electrocoin.

Correct, and those prices also are showing 22% VAT instead of the UK 20%. Which is another £120 Cheaper just on the Pro.

I always thought there were anti competition laws to prevent a single company having a monopoly on sales.
 
Correct, and those prices also are showing 22% VAT instead of the UK 20%. Which is another £120 Cheaper just on the Pro.

I always thought there were anti competition laws to prevent a single company having a monopoly on sales.
There is, however I believe stern are the issue, they insist on bulk purchase of a large number of units making it impossible for a small boutique business like pinball to do. You could buy from stern but the minimum unit order means in reality you can't. Electrocoin real business is gambling machines, so there able to take a hit without breaking a sweat. It probably done by stern because it's easier and no ones challenged it, shipping out small number of units to multiple suppliers in the UK could be a hassle, why bother when you insist on minimum unit orders regardless of actual sales and let the distro take the hit of a load of unsold units in there warehouses. The interesting thing will be how long will electcocoin do this for, if UK customers stop buying due to being priced out, there be a point when they can't have tons of very expensive stock sitting around for years.
 
Stern and Electrocoin are old friends, and I imagine they both profit from the status quo. Not a lawyer but admit it does sound anti-competitive.
 
It's a shame as from what I can tell Electrocoin don't care about or know next to nothing about pinball at all.
 
Never seen so many streams and podcasts for one game

Must have tanked, read on Pinside some distributors didn't sell one game on launch day!!!!
Just feels like they are on a money grab, which is why no one wants one. Too close to jaws and feels saturated by them
 
Never seen so many streams and podcasts for one game

Must have tanked, read on Pinside some distributors didn't sell one game on launch day!!!!
I think it’s a killer combination of a theme that not many people particularly wanted and which some buyers will not want in their homes, being too close to Jaws and Elwin (which IMO will become a classic in time), wider economy starting to bite, and a first time designer which might have made some nervous.

I also reckon some people will be holding onto their wallets to wait for the new Spike 3 system.

Feels a bit like some of the same issues Venom had, with people waiting for Jaws. Foo obviously did okay in similar circumstances but that is a very innovative playfield and a popular designer (albeit also a first timer).
 
Not in the market for any nib but if I was I'd take a punt on wick.. Not a major fan of the franchise but looks more appealing to me than Jaws from what I've seen on streams thus far. I do agree however that the release time between this and Jaws was probably too short.
 
It's only too close to Jaws if you bought one.
I think this is one of the best games they've put out recently. I'll buy one if I sell Pirates.
Good point. Jaws will keep me occupied for awhile yet. But why didn’t they sell any then? Not everyone bought into jaws!

Has to be the saturation and fishing the pool dry..
 
Good point. Jaws will keep me occupied for awhile yet. But why didn’t they sell any then? Not everyone bought into jaws!

Has to be the saturation and fishing the pool dry..
Pricing being the big one, new designer and gungate according to more than one US distributor.

FOMO also appears to be dead, LEs still available for the last few releases.
 
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I'm not sure about the 'new designer' theory. It's either a good game or it isn't, regardless of the designer.
Totally agree. I like the thought of new blood designing games , keeps it fresh so I’d see that as a reason to buy vs not to . Also the designer was a mechanical engineer on games before to I think, so not that ‘new’ anyway. Elwins and dangers first games were hits aswell
 
I'm not sure about the 'new designer' theory. It's either a good game or it isn't, regardless of the designer.
It’s not a theory, it’s the info that’s come from at least two separate distributors, people are waiting to see how this one pans out or skipping all together.

Designer/coder plays a massive part in sales, why do you think Stern put Elwin on Bond60th, his name alone sells units.
 
Also the designer was a mechanical engineer on games before to I think, so not that ‘new’ anyway. Elwins and dangers first games were hits aswell
The mechanical engineer, no one can name, Elliot Eisman btw.

There was also a tonne of confusion on who was designing the game other than it being a first time designer. When a release has Elwin attached to it, it’s almost an event, dizzys in the states have said as much, it’s like an event when his release is next.

You can’t really compare Elwin to other first time designers, he built Archer so everyone knew what he was capable of and what was coming with Maiden. Not to mention he was the number one player in the world.
 
It’s not a theory, it’s the info that’s come from at least two separate distributors, people are waiting to see how this one pans out or skipping all together.

Designer/coder plays a massive part in sales, why do you think Stern put Elwin on Bond60th, his name alone sells units.
His name on bond 60th didn’t help sales sterns biggest flop to date
 
His name on bond 60th didn’t help sales sterns biggest flop to date
That was because of Sterns joke of a price, it wouldn’t have sold a single unit without Elwin attached.

I don’t think Stern would have asked what they did without Elwin attached, no way they would have asked 25k for a Borg game.

We all know certain designers shift games off their name alone, same with the main coder attached, a lot vocally avoid Dwight.
 
That was because of Sterns joke of a price, it wouldn’t have sold a single unit without Elwin attached.

I don’t think Stern would have asked what they did without Elwin attached, no way they would have asked 25k for a Borg game.

We all know certain designers shift games off their name alone, same with the main coder attached, a lot vocally avoid Dwight.
Yeh, I would agree having played it, the price is an absolute joke. If it had been £6k, removing the mechanical scoring mech it probably would have flown out. It's not bad game, bit basic but thats a personal preference as never been a fan of early style pins. It was absolutely pure greed to try and charge £25k for a basic pin and trying to big it up with Elwin name on it. It's personally back fired, the fact that electro coin have sited it a bewick street says it all. Still the pin in 30 years Neil might have the last laugh when it's worth more, but I can't see it. That if bond even last another 30 years 🤣.
You would have thought they had learnt from Beatles. I personally think the issue is stern haven't yet felt the no sale pain, they make in the UK at least take the stock in large numbers as a requirement, which for them means they basically sold them all. The unsold stock is not sitting in stern warehouse, but it's certainly sitting in distro warehouses
 
Just noticed Marco Pinball have a live stream on just now, with Time Sexton and Elliot Eismin.

 
Just checked out the pro in Funland

Paid the £10 for a hour and played John Wick the entire time figuring it out as not really watched a stream after the initial one

Not going to lie I walked away with the grand champion and 4 credits left on it and not overly fussed or excited the point I wanted to buy one… as I know I’d drift back to Jaws or Elton

If you didn’t look at the artwork you wouldn’t know it was a John Wick theme tbh which is a shame.

Shots have a lot of flow and super fast which is great

Inlay for the case is annoying and kept changing the route of the ball too much generally to the right outlane

I’ll enjoy playing this when I see it but not one to buy for me
 
Just checked out the pro in Funland

Paid the £10 for a hour and played John Wick the entire time figuring it out as not really watched a stream after the initial one

Not going to lie I walked away with the grand champion and 4 credits left on it and not overly fussed or excited the point I wanted to buy one… as I know I’d drift back to Jaws or Elton

If you didn’t look at the artwork you wouldn’t know it was a John Wick theme tbh which is a shame.

Shots have a lot of flow and super fast which is great

Inlay for the case is annoying and kept changing the route of the ball too much generally to the right outlane

I’ll enjoy playing this when I see it but not one to buy for me
I had a few games on it yesterday as well mate. It's a fast game but definitely didn't blow me away. I spent more time on Jaws
 
Just checked out the pro in Funland

Paid the £10 for a hour and played John Wick the entire time figuring it out as not really watched a stream after the initial one

Not going to lie I walked away with the grand champion and 4 credits left on it and not overly fussed or excited the point I wanted to buy one… as I know I’d drift back to Jaws or Elton

If you didn’t look at the artwork you wouldn’t know it was a John Wick theme tbh which is a shame.

Shots have a lot of flow and super fast which is great

Inlay for the case is annoying and kept changing the route of the ball too much generally to the right outlane

I’ll enjoy playing this when I see it but not one to buy for me
My review of the Pro at Funland (posted on Pinside):

John Wick Pro, on current code, feels like a B/C-tier Bally Williams. Not iconic or spectacular, but perfectly decent and every now and then, a collector will go “you know, this pin is massively underrated.”

This isn’t a pin for casual or weak players. The layout is very tight, but satisfying and makeable. Strong players will really enjoy nailing the shots. The John Wick Pro in Funland in Russell Square, London, sometimes sent the ball SDTM unfairly (probably 1 in 5 times) from the red circle club - but most of the returns landed either side of the flippers and were saveable (in theory). For an average player, there was a lot of stop-start and trapping up the ball to avoid drains.

Gameplay feels like the by-now-standard Stern formula of ‘start a mode, shoot lit arrows’ and ‘hit something X times to begin multiball’. There are a couple of weird quirks around the skillshots - on the machine I played, it appeared I could get 1 million for a skillshot and start a mode regardless of where I plunged the ball.

There was some kind of Stern Insider levelling up process game to game, but it didn’t seem to make much difference to anything.

The Bill of Materials (BOM) on the Pro remains skimpy, like Venom Pro, with few moving parts (beyond the swing-out car) and plastic stand-ups replacing toys. The whole thing feels cheap and a licence to print money for modders.

The video clips are excellent - lengthy and evocative - even at this stage in the code, which was good as I had plenty of time to watch them*. The callouts were voiced by an actor with a distinctive and interesting voice. Short version - it made me want to watch a John Wick movie.

*The John Wick Pro in Funland had a switch that wasn’t registering on the weapons’ scoop, meaning you had to wait for the ball search to kickout. This made the multiballs broken, and the game slightly tedious to wait around.
 
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