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The days of £50 Rescue 911 have long gone.
David
David
The price of pinball in 2022
- Thread starter Ashbo
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I got a £50 Operation Thunder off our chimney sweep just a few years ago
The new sweep doesn’t have any . Disappointing.
Ive
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Get a new sweepI got a £50 Operation Thunder off our chimney sweep just a few years ago
The new sweep doesn’t have any . Disappointing.
Ive
David
When Dick Van Dyke was on his YTS scheme. Even the machines were steam powered in those days.
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Welcome to GrizZWorld …. A great place to visit, but you wouldn’t want to live here
Damn, I paid £150 for mine. Must have been ripped off.
Yep i agree i made the mistake of buying a new one WAY back and couldn`t believe the backglass was worse than standard to look at ( in my opinion) and the so called gold trim looks more like mustard and all the figures disappeared off the playfield. i felt as if you got less for your money than the standard edition. I was not impressed.Lord of the Rings LE (admittedly an older pin) baffles me.
From what I understand, the difference is the yellow outlined backglass, which I personally don’t like, and that it’s powder coated in gold. Gold powder coating is £100-£300, but LoTR LEs go for much more than non-LEs.
I remain confused by this
I bought my first Centaur for £50. (Sold it, got it back.. sold it again.. now that I have another think i might hang onto it
)
D
Deleted member 2463
more scientific analysis?
not sure I’d call it curated, and the founders often debate the games and the quality of them.
With a post like that I wonder why you are into pinball?
the lamps show you what to do, they’ve been in pinball since the year dot and they now use the most modern and cheapest type to make and longest lasting. on your bored game hobby it would be like using hand drawn parchment instead of inkjet printed boards - why would you do that?
the LCD screen is like any other display for me - it’s relaying info and LCD screens are a cheap and effective way of doing this, and the code, assuming you have a good layout, is what makes a game fun or not - since I’ve been into pinball stern games have had various levels of code complexity but all of them are pretty decent, some even outstanding - (ok except munsters). the stern games get a lot more plays with only AFM keeping station (This is partly owing to the fact that the stern games, by an absolute country mile, are more reliable).
I don’t think there are any bad games in fun land. they don’t play so well because they don’t wax them. But as far as operators games go they aren’t bad.
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I don't know about deep rules making games fun. I think they make a game last maybe.
What makes a game fun for me is the way audio/music, shots, humour and theme are combined. Often why I find the classic B/W games more fun to play. They mastered that combination of kinetic fun.
I think people have a different idea of what makes pinball fun.
I got rid of TMNT for AFM, I liked Turtles for the theme mainly, it felt the theme worked better than most LCD sterns I've played but it didn't feel fun, it felt frustrating and often I didn't want to keep playing, and if I did it was because I was frustrated
AFM just feels fun, it's relatively simple but I want to try again without feeling frustrated. Same with FT and RS.
I just have a great time when I'm playing regardless how badly I'm doing.
Different strokes n all.
What makes a game fun for me is the way audio/music, shots, humour and theme are combined. Often why I find the classic B/W games more fun to play. They mastered that combination of kinetic fun.
I think people have a different idea of what makes pinball fun.
I got rid of TMNT for AFM, I liked Turtles for the theme mainly, it felt the theme worked better than most LCD sterns I've played but it didn't feel fun, it felt frustrating and often I didn't want to keep playing, and if I did it was because I was frustrated
AFM just feels fun, it's relatively simple but I want to try again without feeling frustrated. Same with FT and RS.
I just have a great time when I'm playing regardless how badly I'm doing.
Different strokes n all.
D
Deleted member 2463
You should think hard about what you really enjoy - no matter the theme / art / music / humour it won’t outlive a crap game. And this is what Gomez always says - ball and flippers is what makes a game. Code can’t even save a game - ghostbusters was a great theme epic art toys comedy (this man has no dick etc) music etc. but the ball and flippers sucked - I held onto it for the final update and it was a great update but as I was playing I just thought this is the same game and the game sucks. Sold it weeks later.
Your frustration is to do with the toughness of the game also. If I set up a game you love to be as hard as turtles out of the box I predict you will start to hate it. This is where owning a game counts because you can set it up as easy as you like.
Your frustration is to do with the toughness of the game also. If I set up a game you love to be as hard as turtles out of the box I predict you will start to hate it. This is where owning a game counts because you can set it up as easy as you like.
I'm a poor player, no question! I play for the enjoyment and NPB scores not competition like yourself. For those reasons I don't think I'd tire of modern games. What I don't like is being mugged by a "drain monster". If I owned a game like that I think it would be gone. I loved GOT as a TV show but did I enjoy the 2-3 games I played, no.
Price too pays a part, if it doesn't owe you too much you'd cut it some slack and hold onto it. That's the collector in me who loves machines, cleaning and improving them. (Not chucking add-on's at it, just improving the overall condition of the machine compared to when I bought it). This probably explains why I owned a non working Star Wars Videogame upright for years, everytime I walked past it, I'd go - "Phwoarr!".
more scientific analysis?
Haven’t you heard of Sturgeon’s Law?
Well, it is curated. By default, the pins in there have been bought by someone, which means they liked them. If a pin is old, they liked that specific pin more than a newer or different pin they could have bought instead.
I think you missed the point.
However, you’ve made the point I was trying to make here. Most of the 90s games that get bought, and talked about (like AFM) are pins that are regarded as ‘the best of 90s B/W’, which covers a pretty long period of time. There are also lots of pins made in that period that are ‘meh’, largely forgotten, and in some cases ‘OMG, I can’t believe someone would pay X for that trash on eBay’.
The modern Sterns in Funland cover a shorter period of history than the B/W era, so you would expect that only a few of them will be seen as desirable in 20 years time. Because that’s the way stuff works - some stuff that was fun, exciting and novel when it came out seems forgotten, tired, chintzy, embarrassing or old fashioned a couple of decades later. Other stuff stands the test of time.
It’s not that the LEDs, LCDs make for a bad game. It’s that a mediocre game isn’t saved by these things (which is exactly what you said).
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looking at the pin landscape I think I’ll be trading games as opposed to selling from here on, some horrendous prices on eBay at the mo. Might even downsize abit. What a complete change around this form has seen with covid. Rubbish really but fun when it lasted
OP
OP
Ashbo
Site Supporter
I can't help feel partly responsible, joining the fun on the crest of a wave and then beached with the promise of changing and swapping pins threatened by the wave I came in on.
Planning to sit tight, improve the games I have and have fun for a while. If a reasonable pin comes along that I get permission to buy, great, but until then just enjoy what I have.
Funnily enough there are 4 of us meeting up today to exchange/swap/loan pins from each other just to freshen things up. Not a penny will exchange hands.
Ghostbusters is going but I've had it a few months and feel like I've owned it. It's going to another forum member but not the one who owns it and I'm bringing something else back.
This is certainly the way to go at the moment with the way the market is.
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Temporary swaps / loans with trusted pinheads is of course a good way to keep things fresh.
The market is horrible at the moment for actually getting hold of anything, let alone a particular title - unless you pay over the odds . Most of the last few pins that have come through for me have been word of mouth/lucky deals …… the office across the road with a dead pin, an op locally retiring selling off a few, a mate of my brothers ,our chimney sweep
I do miss the old pin world though
Oh well . Keep on flippin and enjoy whatever you can .
Just about to convert sega rally into a multicade twin via slot aaa, arcades are also fun if you get the right ones, converting s twin to play 10 /15 classic sega arcade racers , might sell one if anyone keen .
Ok, who's been having a go on the wikipedia article?
"And on that hangs Sturgeon’s revelation. It came to him that [science fiction] is indeed ninety-percent crud, but that also – Eureka! – ninety-percent of everything is crud. All things – cars, books, cheeses, hairstyles, people, and pins are, to the expert and discerning eye, crud, except for the acceptable tithe which we each happen to like."
Long term pinball prices are going to march onward and upward as the manufacturing costs and parts costs increase with inflation. I don’t think anyone will disagree with that?
In the medium term it’s a lot more difficult to predict - it’s basically supply and demand which is a short and med term factor, but that in itself has many facets which come down to affordability and personal economics.
I expect a softening of prices in next year or two before the inevitable upward march. I expect manufacturers to increase prices again. this year (I have no proof or inside information). Like many of the older folks on here I’ve lived through a couple of bouts of inflation and rising interest rates. It isn’t going to be fun, there will be some fire sales.
In the medium term it’s a lot more difficult to predict - it’s basically supply and demand which is a short and med term factor, but that in itself has many facets which come down to affordability and personal economics.
I expect a softening of prices in next year or two before the inevitable upward march. I expect manufacturers to increase prices again. this year (I have no proof or inside information). Like many of the older folks on here I’ve lived through a couple of bouts of inflation and rising interest rates. It isn’t going to be fun, there will be some fire sales.
Personally, I don't think you can beat a fish playing a drum kit
It was not me. However, I’ve checked. It’s still there and it’s hilariousOk, who's been having a go on the wikipedia article?
"And on that hangs Sturgeon’s revelation. It came to him that [science fiction] is indeed ninety-percent crud, but that also – Eureka! – ninety-percent of everything is crud. All things – cars, books, cheeses, hairstyles, people, and pins are, to the expert and discerning eye, crud, except for the acceptable tithe which we each happen to like."
OMG. That was a significant percentage of why I wanted a Color DMD for Fish Tales. The first thing I wanted to see when I got it in operation was the fish with the drum kit in full colour!Personally, I don't think you can beat a fish playing a drum kit
Yup that's one of those little touches that just makes you smile!
I love the fish drummer
To be fair Turtles was mine, I could set it up easier, but I set all my games up about the same. I never change how easy modes are or ball saves etc.
I know it's a tough game by itself but it seems to be tough unfairly.
It's hard to feel you've achieved something. The scoring doesn't help, I know turtles isn't seen as one of the great modern Sterns but I do think it's something about the Stern design in general.
I wonder how different they'd be if they had to rely on just a DMD, would the limitation help?
I know there are stern DMD games so I must be barking up the wrong tree.
I can't put my finger on it.
And it's off topic
I love the fish drummer
To be fair Turtles was mine, I could set it up easier, but I set all my games up about the same. I never change how easy modes are or ball saves etc.
I know it's a tough game by itself but it seems to be tough unfairly.
It's hard to feel you've achieved something. The scoring doesn't help, I know turtles isn't seen as one of the great modern Sterns but I do think it's something about the Stern design in general.
I wonder how different they'd be if they had to rely on just a DMD, would the limitation help?
I know there are stern DMD games so I must be barking up the wrong tree.
I can't put my finger on it.
And it's off topic
D
Deleted member 2463
Turtles isn’t seen as one of the great stern games - it’s a marmite pinball machine - people love it or hate it. at tournaments people avoid it like the plague. The games wouldn’t be any different at all - you‘d just have more ropey graphics. Ghostbusters was supposed to be a LCD game but they just digitised all the movie parts instead.
You get some drains that seem unfair on Turtles but the code is very casual friendly imo. If you don't get any of those unfair feeling drains you can progress very quickly through the game by learning to hit 3 shots well - left ramp, right ramp, pizza parlour, that covers starting your modes and the pretty easy to get multiballs. The targets are banks which makes them easier and you don't have to successfully complete the modes to get to final battle, you only have to start them. The unfair feeling drains can make it quite random how well you do which is why some people don't like it I think. I had 2 games in a row yesterday, one I only got 2 modes, the second was my best ball one ever and I completed 7 modes (2EB's), its not a game I can be consistent every game on. When I drain on JP I can usually see 'oh I should have done that or I shouldn't have done that' Turtles sometimes you just think 'there was nothing I could have done there!'
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I can't say I fully understand Wikipedia but it says the page was edited 29 days ago? I was expecting either yesterday or today's date after Vee brought up the adage yesterday?Ok, who's been having a go on the wikipedia article?
"And on that hangs Sturgeon’s revelation. It came to him that [science fiction] is indeed ninety-percent crud, but that also – Eureka! – ninety-percent of everything is crud. All things – cars, books, cheeses, hairstyles, people, and pins are, to the expert and discerning eye, crud, except for the acceptable tithe which we each happen to like."
“Long term pinball prices are going to march onward and upward as the manufacturing costs and parts costs increase with inflation. I don’t think anyone will disagree with that?”
Not entirely sure I agree with that. Roll on 10 years and a lot of us are going to be the wrong side of 60. Slower reactions and a temptation to flog games to allow earlier retirement.
I highly doubt either of my kids will want my games or have the space to keep them. A lot of us will be downsizing to more manageable properties. Not to be too morbid but a few of us will probably have shuffled off
All in all we could see a large increase in the supply of 2nd hand machines combined with a huge decrease in demand.
Whether or not this would also force the price of new pins down would probably depend what their current profit margins are.
I know there are some young players but I’d be willing to bet that the vast majority of us can remember the fall of the Berlin Wall etc.
Not entirely sure I agree with that. Roll on 10 years and a lot of us are going to be the wrong side of 60. Slower reactions and a temptation to flog games to allow earlier retirement.
I highly doubt either of my kids will want my games or have the space to keep them. A lot of us will be downsizing to more manageable properties. Not to be too morbid but a few of us will probably have shuffled off
All in all we could see a large increase in the supply of 2nd hand machines combined with a huge decrease in demand.
Whether or not this would also force the price of new pins down would probably depend what their current profit margins are.
I know there are some young players but I’d be willing to bet that the vast majority of us can remember the fall of the Berlin Wall etc.
I remember the fall of the Berlin Wall…
I also have a two-year-old son so, barring the marvels of modern medicine, I can’t be the wrong side of 60 in a decade’s time!
Is that 19k GZ LE at Games room coy a typo?
Also, newbies getting blamed for the prices going up...lol
It's a bit of a double edged sword that one.
Also, newbies getting blamed for the prices going up...lol
It's a bit of a double edged sword that one.
