T2 pinball ball stuck

[Stereojet]

Hi,

Occasionally whilst playing a game on my T2, the ball will get stuck in the section where the target lowers (under the endo skull) rather than shooting the ball around to the canon, it just sits under the skull. Any tips on how I can correct this issue?

Thanks for your time.

 

[Jay Walker]

Hello, is the target lowering flush with the playfield? Due to there being a pathway beyond the target, the metal frame for the 'wedge-top' target has an adjustable stop for the level of the target when 'down'. Check first that there's nothing obstructing the target, it's not unknown for it to be bodged up with incorrect parts, affecting the dropping action.

Or is the ball sitting in the 'ball popper' without being punched upwards into the wire track? This would be the switch for the popper not reading, if so on the next occasion go into tests and select a Switch Test; 'Levels' shows all switches currently registering, so the popper switch (No, 7,6) should be among those listed. If not, check the switch wiring, the adjustment/cleanliness of the contacts on the switch blades, and if other switches on the two lines, Column 7 and Row 6, are affected.

 

[Stereojet]

Hello, is the target lowering flush with the playfield? Due to there being a pathway beyond the target, the metal frame for the 'wedge-top' target has an adjustable stop for the level of the target when 'down'. Check first that there's nothing obstructing the target, it's not unknown for it to be bodged up with incorrect parts, affecting the dropping action.

Or is the ball sitting in the 'ball popper' without being punched upwards into the wire track? This would be the switch for the popper not reading, if so on the next occasion go into tests and select a Switch Test; 'Levels' shows all switches currently registering, so the popper switch (No, 7,6) should be among those listed. If not, check the switch wiring, the adjustment/cleanliness of the contacts on the switch blades, and if other switches on the two lines, Column 7 and Row 6, are affected.

Will do, thank you.

 

[Ant-H]

It definitely sounds like the switch is causing the issue.

If the wires are all good, the switch itself will need adjusting so when the ball sits in the ball pooper the weight pushes down the switch and makes contact.

It can be quite a pain in the **** to get spot on especially as you doing it with the playfield in the vertical position.

 

[Asiapinball]

@Dinsdale had the same issue when he first got his t2. The target mechanism below the playfield was completely chewed up and had been bodge repaired so you couldn't even adjust the level of the drop target properly and the metal bar that pushes tne drop target up was trashed too. I think he ended up just replacing the whole assembly as there was so much wrong with it. Drop targets can get sticky over time as the pinball dust mixes with the small amount of grease that is used to lubricate them. A good strip down and clean can make them snappy again if there are no broken parts.

 

[Asiapinball]

1-Bank Smart Drop Target Assembly - Physical Switch - Left

1-Bank Smart Drop Target Assembly for various pinball machines. PBL-100-0043-00

www.pinballlife.com

Entire mechanism at pinball life if you have to go that route.

@1stoppinball or @David retro can get one in for you if they don't have stock in uk already.

 

[Stereojet]

Thanks guys, really appreciate the info.

 

[Jay Walker]

Seeing your other query, T2 may have the ball popper inhibited (by leaving a ball in it) if the cannon is out of action. Is that resolved? The later Star Trek Next Gen bars access to a cannon if it's not working, by not using the relevant diverter.

 

[Stereojet]

Seeing your other query, T2 may have the ball popper inhibited (by leaving a ball in it) if the cannon is out of action. Is that resolved? The later Star Trek Next Gen bars access to a cannon if it's not working, by not using the relevant diverter.

It seems to be behaving itself now, I’m a total noob at pinball care, I levelled the playfield properly to 6.5 degrees and lo and behold, it’s started to behave itself. It is now flashing up “check switches 26 and 58” which I have done, but can’t see anything obvious with the switches either on top of the playfield or under it. It’s all very daunting for a noob!

 

[Jay Walker]

A Test Report specifying 'Check Switches' only really means that the program hasn't seen them operate for a while. Some games can have one showing most of the time, with nothing actually wrong.

Switch 2,6 (Column 2, Row 6) is listed as the Left Return lane, leading to the l/h flipper, and 5,8 is the rightmost of the three top rollover lanes, above the jet bumpers. Look at the switch tests, in Switch Edges operating a switch should show its name and number in the display, and indicate it in the Column/Row grid on-screen (the location in the grid changes to a square when the switch is closed). Both of those are rollover wires, operating a microswitch. If it's quiet, you should be able to hear the switch click as the contacts open/close. They could be maladjusted, and always Closed. Adjustment is made by carefully bending the rollover wire, with the power Off, but check that the hinged attachment to the switch is okay; it's clipped over two nubs on the plastic casing of the switch.

Another possibility is that the wiring's at fault elsewhere on the playfield. That 'matrix' arrangement of 8 columns and 8 rows allows up to 64 different switches with only 16 wire runs, but it means that each Row and Column appears at multiple locations on the playfield, in the cabinet and sometimes the Insert board behind the backglass. To save on wire, the playfield switch wiring is daisy-chained between all the points for each particular wire. Generally running from the back of the playfield to the front.

For example, Column 2 on the playfield is Left Outlane, 25, Left Return, 26, Right Return, 27, and Right Outlane, 28. One of those will be first in line, and one last, so a break in that wire could affect any or all of them. While Row 6 is also Trough Centre, a critical switch (tracking the balls held under the front arch), one Red target, one Orange target, Top Lane Left, one of the Chase Loop rollovers and Ball Popper. In this case, there'd be more of a problem if Trough Centre was out, so it seems okay as far as that, but Left Return could be last in line for Row 6.

 

[drhex]

Find their location using the manual. Go into switch test and actuate them using a ball. If they register, great, if not loosen the screws and get them working. Don't overtighten screws, they can squash the switches. Machine will show them as broken if they don't get actuated in a number of games, so may be just fine.

 

[Stereojet]

Find their location using the manual. Go into switch test and actuate them using a ball. If they register, great, if not loosen the screws and get them working. Don't overtighten screws, they can squash the switches. Machine will show them as broken if they don't get actuated in a number of games, so may be just fine.

I’ve not had any other messages saying that they’re broken.

 

[Stereojet]

A Test Report specifying 'Check Switches' only really means that the program hasn't seen them operate for a while. Some games can have one showing most of the time, with nothing actually wrong.

Switch 2,6 (Column 2, Row 6) is listed as the Left Return lane, leading to the l/h flipper, and 5,8 is the rightmost of the three top rollover lanes, above the jet bumpers. Look at the switch tests, in Switch Edges operating a switch should show its name and number in the display, and indicate it in the Column/Row grid on-screen (the location in the grid changes to a square when the switch is closed). Both of those are rollover wires, operating a microswitch. If it's quiet, you should be able to hear the switch click as the contacts open/close. They could be maladjusted, and always Closed. Adjustment is made by carefully bending the rollover wire, with the power Off, but check that the hinged attachment to the switch is okay; it's clipped over two nubs on the plastic casing of the switch.

Another possibility is that the wiring's at fault elsewhere on the playfield. That 'matrix' arrangement of 8 columns and 8 rows allows up to 64 different switches with only 16 wire runs, but it means that each Row and Column appears at multiple locations on the playfield, in the cabinet and sometimes the Insert board behind the backglass. To save on wire, the playfield switch wiring is daisy-chained between all the points for each particular wire. Generally running from the back of the playfield to the front.

For example, Column 2 on the playfield is Left Outlane, 25, Left Return, 26, Right Return, 27, and Right Outlane, 28. One of those will be first in line, and one last, so a break in that wire could affect any or all of them. While Row 6 is also Trough Centre, a critical switch (tracking the balls held under the front arch), one Red target, one Orange target, Top Lane Left, one of the Chase Loop rollovers and Ball Popper. In this case, there'd be more of a problem if Trough Centre was out, so it seems okay as far as that, but Left Return could be last in line for Row 6.

Thanks for the in depth information! Appreciate it.

 

[drhex]

I’ve not had any other messages saying that they’re broken.

You should get a bong on switching the machine on, a dot behind the credit counter (or Free Play) and the check switch messages when you enter menu. Tht is how the machine tells you it suspects them broken. Given @Jay Walker identified them and they are used constantly there is a high likelihood they are broken/misadjusted as per his post.

 

[Stereojet]

A Test Report specifying 'Check Switches' only really means that the program hasn't seen them operate for a while. Some games can have one showing most of the time, with nothing actually wrong.

Switch 2,6 (Column 2, Row 6) is listed as the Left Return lane, leading to the l/h flipper, and 5,8 is the rightmost of the three top rollover lanes, above the jet bumpers. Look at the switch tests, in Switch Edges operating a switch should show its name and number in the display, and indicate it in the Column/Row grid on-screen (the location in the grid changes to a square when the switch is closed). Both of those are rollover wires, operating a microswitch. If it's quiet, you should be able to hear the switch click as the contacts open/close. They could be maladjusted, and always Closed. Adjustment is made by carefully bending the rollover wire, with the power Off, but check that the hinged attachment to the switch is okay; it's clipped over two nubs on the plastic casing of the switch.

Another possibility is that the wiring's at fault elsewhere on the playfield. That 'matrix' arrangement of 8 columns and 8 rows allows up to 64 different switches with only 16 wire runs, but it means that each Row and Column appears at multiple locations on the playfield, in the cabinet and sometimes the Insert board behind the backglass. To save on wire, the playfield switch wiring is daisy-chained between all the points for each particular wire. Generally running from the back of the playfield to the front.

For example, Column 2 on the playfield is Left Outlane, 25, Left Return, 26, Right Return, 27, and Right Outlane, 28. One of those will be first in line, and one last, so a break in that wire could affect any or all of them. While Row 6 is also Trough Centre, a critical switch (tracking the balls held under the front arch), one Red target, one Orange target, Top Lane Left, one of the Chase Loop rollovers and Ball Popper. In this case, there'd be more of a problem if Trough Centre was out, so it seems okay as far as that, but Left Return could be last in line for Row 6.

I did the test and it looks like the bottom left one isn’t detecting but the top right is.

 

[drhex]

OK, important to try with a ball as your finger may depress the switch deeper. Is the lower one clicking on operation? All the cables on?

 

[Jay Walker]

That should take care of the report for 5,8, anyway. It's odd for a lane switch to reach the report stage without an actual problem, though.

For the return lane, the display shows us it isn't stuck Closed - there'd be a square at the node 2,6. To get a bit tactile, does the switch feel as if it's making contact? Those microswitches have a 'snap' to them, as you could see from the top lane.

Have another look below the playfield, with the power Off. Try the return lane switch by using a fingernail to pull the wire/blade downwards, it may have lost enough adjustment for the ball to operate the switch from above, i.e. the wire isn't sticking up enough for the ball pressing it down to make contact. If you then feel/hear it operate, carefully adjust the wire.

If it seems to have been operating okay in any case, then the switch may have finally worn out; they usually last a long time, but it is over 30 years now. In a switch test, for elimination it's okay to carefully connect the Column and Row wires together with a short 'jumper' wire, expecting to see the switch register. It would cause all kinds of difficulty in play, but for test purposes it's okay. Doing so between the Green w/trace Column wire and the striped end of the switch diode checks the diode, too. i.e. connecting Green-trace to White-trace shows if the wiring is okay, then between Green-trace and striped end of diode shows diode is okay, leaving only the switch.

Or, if this still shows no response, check the two lines (Green-red and White-blue) back along their routes across the playfield. Refer to the switch matrix chart to confirm where they appear, though I described them earlier. In this case, I'd suspect the Row 6 wire, it's the only thing on that line in that area.

 

[Stereojet]

That should take care of the report for 5,8, anyway. It's odd for a lane switch to reach the report stage without an actual problem, though.

For the return lane, the display shows us it isn't stuck Closed - there'd be a square at the node 2,6. To get a bit tactile, does the switch feel as if it's making contact? Those microswitches have a 'snap' to them, as you could see from the top lane.

Have another look below the playfield, with the power Off. Try the return lane switch by using a fingernail to pull the wire/blade downwards, it may have lost enough adjustment for the ball to operate the switch from above, i.e. the wire isn't sticking up enough for the ball pressing it down to make contact. If you then feel/hear it operate, carefully adjust the wire.

If it seems to have been operating okay in any case, then the switch may have finally worn out; they usually last a long time, but it is over 30 years now. In a switch test, for elimination it's okay to carefully connect the Column and Row wires together with a short 'jumper' wire, expecting to see the switch register. It would cause all kinds of difficulty in play, but for test purposes it's okay. Doing so between the Green w/trace Column wire and the striped end of the switch diode checks the diode, too. i.e. connecting Green-trace to White-trace shows if the wiring is okay, then between Green-trace and striped end of diode shows diode is okay, leaving only the switch.

Or, if this still shows no response, check the two lines (Green-red and White-blue) back along their routes across the playfield. Refer to the switch matrix chart to confirm where they appear, though I described them earlier. In this case, I'd suspect the Row 6 wire, it's the only thing on that line in that area.

I adjusted the connection part of the switch, it was slightly bent downwards and not actually engaging the switch, I used some long nosed pliers to bend it back to its original position. Seems to be engaging ok now, I’ll do another test tomorrow to be sure thanks for your help.

 

[Stereojet]

OK, important to try with a ball as your finger may depress the switch deeper. Is the lower one clicking on operation? All the cables on?

It seems to engage ok with the ball as well now, thanks

 

[Jay Walker]

That's good, then. We could have been getting into soldering to repair broken connections, or replace the switch.

 

[Stereojet]

That's good, then. We could have been getting into soldering to repair broken connections, or replace the switch.

Next thing to sort out is this canon, which seems to have mood swings. Sometimes it works fine, sometimes it swings around wildly for no apparent reason.