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I think I'm done buying used

Epotech

Epotech

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Phil Dixon
With used games approaching what would have been NIB not long ago and all the newbs offering "that's a good price" comments without actually knowing and the lack of anything to buy anyway; What's the point of buying used anymore?

I can spend about a grand less, maybe, for a nearly new but I think (unless its from Chris B) its just not worth it IMHO.


Ironically, I can't buy new either! LOL.
 
It’s a bit of a blanket statement. If a used game you wanted, came up at a price you thought was great, why would you not buy it? There’s still good, fair deals to be had, not every sale or trade is publicly advertised.
And it’s not ‘the newbs’ driving these prices up. It’s lack of availability. The UK’s largest distributor can’t give a price or date most of the time on new pins so it’s no wonder people buy used for close to NIB prices.
It’s a choice, if prices are too high then it’s sensible not to buy. But when a pin is offered at a good price it’s silly not to buy.
 
There are still £2k decent used games out there (which is far from low end £7k ish nib price) But those deals are coming up less and less
 
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Not always though (that’s my point)
BM66 - 11k, one sold recently for £7250, that gaps plenty big enough.
JP2 - £7.4K, got mine not too long ago for £5.5k - big enough gap for me.
But on top of this many NIB have an unknown lead time so it’s a lottery of when you’ll get one.
 
If Phil can't get hold of many games because Stern aren't getting them built it stands to reason that games that are a year or two old and still highly desirable are going to hold their value no? Not to mention the massive price increases. I might be a newb still not sure
 
Sven Normansson said:
With used games approaching what would have been NIB not long ago and all the newbs offering "that's a good price" comments without actually knowing and the lack of anything to buy anyway; What's the point of buying used anymore?

I can spend about a grand less, maybe, for a nearly new but I think (unless its from Chris B) its just not worth it IMHO.


Ironically, I can't buy new either! LOL.
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Sounds like a plan. Could just point me in the direction of a brand new Centaur please ;)
 
You get the point though. I have no interest in newer pins (I'm the same with cars and other stuff too). I'm sure I am not the only one.

Also, looking at their website they haven't exactly got a huge range. And if Stern are struggling to keep up with demand I suspect Haggis are going to also ?
 
It was 4k.
I have no idea as to how well built the Haggis machines are - but if they are anything like new cars probably the used one :)
A Centaur that sold for 4k is going to be pretty robust - or it wont fetch 4k ? Same goes for most. (there are some folks wanting that for mediocre machines on flea bay - they are generally still on there!)
 
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Just talking about pins that are still being manufactured, I feel like its more a case of wanting now rather than wait ... no one knows how long. Used prices are going up because NIB prices have gone up. I said this in another thread, I'm a noob but when I joined a NIB pro was £6795, used were going for about £5500-£5750. NIB pro is now £7395-7495 used pros still being manufactured are £6000-6500, so the gap is about the same and you usually get some mods on a used too.

For a machine still in production I kinda work on the thinking 20% off NIB price then adding on the cost of whatever mods have been added is fair. It's not quite that simple because then there's the added how highly rated the game is and how many have come up for sale, have there been a lot of wanted ads etc But that's just my personal price guide...ish, other people will be willing to pay more or less.

At least we're not in the same situation as the US where you can buy a NIB and immediately flip it for more money.
 
lots of sales on here that make my eyes water and I’m-not short of money! -if people see the value then good luck to them. Twice now though I’ve bought a game in the last 12 months that was in a fire sale because the economic situation was hurting folks.

let see what the market is like in April/may.
 
Fubar said:
Indeed some very expensive games listed/sold recently, but did they really sell for asking price?
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A good question. Ebay auction closing prices don't mean it was sold at that price. Non payments and 2nd chance offers etc. Also outright shill bidding by friends. So you take it all with a pinch of salt.
Do I wish I'd offered more, bid higher to save me missing stuff in the past? Sure but who knows what's round the corner financially for us all?
 
This is a great post and going to be a good discussion

First thank s for your kind comments Phil I assume you mentioned this because of the turtles you bought from me recently and probably many other games
So I am going to use turtles as an example on people paying over the top
I sold turtles to Phil for £6250 huo although it did go to pin fest it had around 300 plays on it I think lots of mods inc art blades shaker motor Le sound package speaker lights multi sparkly powder coating in green I think a fair price for £6250 it didn’t fly out the door
I then see another one come up no mods with 4000 plays for £6500 sold straight away now compare that to mine and you will see a silly price
Ph had 3 left after pin fest that all sold nib for £6500
Andydn said:
Not always though (that’s my point)
BM66 - 11k, one sold recently for £7250, that gaps plenty big enough.
JP2 - £7.4K, got mine not too long ago for £5.5k - big enough gap for me.
But on top of this many NIB have an unknown lead time so it’s a lottery of when you’ll get one.
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No one on here is going to pay 11k for a bm66 when the game launched it was £8500 so still a 1k loss
Your jp would have been £6500 nib so at £5500 it’s about right for the time you bought it
It’s only the fact that prices have gone up £1000 that £5500 seems cheep
I think newbies are definitely pushing up the prices here are a few examples that stand out to me of recent shadow £1500 no board s and missing many other parts my take on that was £500-800 and I have all the boards to put in it that is going to be a very expensive shadow when done and only ever be an average game
Super mario with poor pics and trashed playfield pretty much scrap
Wh02 £4500 missing lots of parts and a real mess I just sold a really nice one for £4500 with Color display
St Le with damage £8000 I sold one not so long ago for £6500 with Color display
But at the end of the day it’s what people are willing to pay I suppose
 
Neil McRae said:
lots of sales on here that make my eyes water and I’m-not short of money! -if people see the value then good luck to them. Twice now though I’ve bought a game in the last 12 months that was in a fire sale because the economic situation was hurting folks.

let see what the market is like in April/may.
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Next year is going to be interesting times are going to be much harder nib prices won’t change and I think that stern will start catching up with the backlog
 
I think important factors here are fashion and supply constraints.

Fashion

Old timers have had many years of owning and playing what I consider to be the best era of pinball machines made in the late 70s to mid 90s.

Opposing this, there is a growing market for 80s and 90s electronic nostalgia. I was sad enough to watch a YouTube video about a 1980s technics cd player that was sold to punters as well as to radio stations. These things are going for high hundreds now.

My youtube feed is now full of videos about 1980 and 1990s hifi stuff.

If you are bored with the older stuff and you want something new, something that surprises you, then you are attempting to buy the latest titles when there is a shortage of supply.

10 buyers of turtles, 5 turtles means prices Will be firm. And paying an extra 10 per cent to get one is probably neither hear nor there for folk.

Nearly new car prices have been outstripping new for some time in America. Older used cars are more valuable now than they were a year ago. Classic cars have gone turbo.

It is thus entirely logical that you may pay a premium for a used, recent pinball title.

I think @CHRIS B PINBALLS is spot on. When the new games start arriving and the eager buyers get filled, then I think there will be a different dynamic.

My only ever experience of NIB was a JJP Dialed in which was very poorly set up. I spent as much time messing about with it as I would do on a decent working mid 90s title so there is even an argument to get a nearly new game as the previous owner will have been through the pain of updates, new software, workarounds, fettling the thing....
 
CHRIS B PINBALLS said:
St Le with damage £8000 I sold one not so long ago for £6500 with Color display
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It sold for £7k though -- £1000 less than asking price. With a bit of TLC I don't think I'll lose much on it.

Of course yours still looks £800 cheaper but I don't remember it being advertised on here?

My last 2 pins sold without advertising, and my current ones have buyers lined up already 🤷‍♂️
 
God damn us newbs….
Throwing money around willynilly…
Lucky I have a bottomless pit of cash to do such a thing 🙄
There’s a nice Iron Man Vault Born 2020 at Williams Amusements BTW…
Is this a good price? Shy of 8k I think…
I’m not sure, loads of mods…..
Sometime we hear mods add value, others not so….
 
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Sako-TRG said:
God damn us newbs….
Throwing money around willynilly…
Lucky I have a bottomless pit of cash to do such a thing 🙄
There’s a nice Iron Man Vault Born 2020 at Williams Amusements BTW…
Is this a good price? Shy of 8k I think…
I’m not sure, loads of mods…..
Sometime we hear mods add value, others not so….
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its my old iron man vault that !! fully loaded :)
 
There is definitely a FOMO fear of missing out vibe at the moment as lots of buyers chase a modest number of machines
 
DRD said:
There is definitely a FOMO fear of missing out vibe at the moment as lots of buyers chase a modest number of machines
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that's the problem with FOMO it's fake, if you wait long enough they will eventually come up for sale at some point down the road, its fear of missing out NOW lol
 
Folk buying and setting aside pinballs, cars that only see the road on the back of trailers, watches that remain unworn and boxed, wine in bonded warehouses .....

A lot of speculating/ investing going on right now
 
I just picked up a BM'66 for 5k+vat.

Deals are out there. Does that mean that's what they're worth? Probably not.

Collectors will always have a price range for games and most of us have been in the hobby long enough to know if you're selling most people want the top of that range and if you're buying the bottom end!
 
russdx1 said:
that's the problem with FOMO it's fake, if you wait long enough they will eventually come up for sale at some point down the road, its fear of missing out NOW lol
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True but you don’t live forever and quite a few of us are getting on and have big bellies😂 (and bank accounts😱)
A lot are getting sold without being advertised so it could be a long wait☹️
 
M4carp said:
True but you don’t live forever and quite a few of us are getting on and have big bellies😂 (and bank accounts😱)
A lot are getting sold without being advertised so it could be a long wait☹️
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I'm 36 am I an old man now lol? wish my bank account was big hahaha
 
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