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In Progress F-14 Tomcat shop log

Sweet.
Are you taking it to bed tonight ? ;)

Can tell how happy you are now she is back home.
 
"If you want to know more about the P-ROC on System 11 machines drop me a line"

How many of the boards did you have to use? I was in deep looking at them the other day and one can only do 16 switches?

I need to go back and look to get head round it a bit more.
 
Hi Dave,

To have a P-ROC run a Sys11, you need :

  • A P-ROC board.
  • Whatever kind of computer you plan to run the software on. I use a cheap Windows PC.
  • One of the Sys11 "combo-boards" that I designed with some help of others on the forum.

You remove the existing Sys11 MPU board from the machine and replace with the P-ROC and combo-board. Most of the cables then connect back to the combo-board. The switch matrix cables connect direct to the P-ROC via a little adapter harness (because the P-ROC switch connections are laid out a little different).

That's about it. You then need though to think about what kind of display you want to use. You can keep the existing alphanumeric display and use that, but you'll need Jim's (mypinballs on here and on the P-ROC forum) little adapter board so that the P-ROC can drive it. You could use an LED DMD display, but you'll need to work out how to mount it in the machine. You can also use a PC monitor for the display, again you'd need to work out how to mount it.

If you need more info, drop me a line!
 
Nice. Thanks for explaining. Crystal.

"One of the Sys11 "combo-boards" that I designed with some help of others on the forum."

This is what I was trying to ask about, combo boards. I've seen them stacked etc. Just that one combo board does the whole table? Everything switch? lamps? solenoid?
 
Just the one board. So a P-ROC, computer, Sys11 board will get you up and running. Plus you need to think about the displays. In this picture :

http://www.pinballcontrollers.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=683.0;attach=1434

On the left you can just see the P-ROC, the main board in the picture is the Sys11 combo board and mounted on that is the optional alphanumeric adapter from mypinballs if that's the kind of display you choose to use. The switch cables connect to the P-ROC, all the solenoids and lamps connect to the combo-board.

All the various other driver boards that are listed over on the pinballcontrollers.com site are for folks building their own custom machines from scratch.
 
Ah cool, thanks. That's where I was getting confused. Would like to use for a custom table from scratch, so I'd more than likely need a few of the combo boards , but with an existing machine you can just jump off the main board.

"All the various other driver boards that are listed over on the pinballcontrollers.com site are for folks building their own custom machines from scratch."

Nice, will do some window shopping later on! Cheers.
 
Are you using this pyprocgame?

"Interfaces to Visual Pinball for playing on virtual machines (dev in progress)"

Was just wondering if I could probably do the same with Unit3D pinball but would probs have to write something myself to interact with that? I'm building an F-14 in that now and the script uses C#.

I've never tried Python yet properly, only used it with editing xbmc scripts.
 
Yes, I'm using the pyprocgame framework. I have a programming background, but hadn't used Python before, so my "for dummies" book is quite well thumbed. I'm starting over again with my code, so will need to blow the cobwebs off again later in the year.

I've not tried using pyprocgame to control a virtual machine, although I know some folks have. I just use it on the physical machine. I'd strongly suggest you join the pinballcontrollers forum (pinballcontrollers.com/forum), read around some more then start to ask questions. We're a friendly bunch and have different areas of skills so whatever you ask someone will likely point you in the right direction. Once I finally get a playfield back in my Tomcat (summer, hopefully) you're more than welcome to come and see my P-ROC/Sys-11/programming setup if you want. If you're in W.Sussex somewhere you're not a million miles away from Maidstone where I am.

-Mark
 
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"so will need to blow the cobwebs off again later in the year"

Yes, know that problem all too well. If you tend to slack off a bit from doing anything like that it slowly disappears from the memory. I had looked into some other languages before and Python seemed to be coined as easy to pick up.

From the time I made the above post I've trawled through the forum and started the install. I had seen you wanting to try your code with VP :). There wasn't an awful lot to read there but got the gist of what can be done now. So I could get cracking on a game without purchasing a p-roc yet from what I can gather? Looking more than likely I shall make an appearance over there too at some point then, thanks.

"Once I finally get a playfield back in my Tomcat (summer, hopefully) you're more than welcome to come and see my P-ROC/Sys-11/programming setup if you want. If you're in W.Sussex somewhere you're not a million miles away from Maidstone where I am."

Cool. Nope, not far at all , definitely take up on the offer there mate, Cheers!
 
Yes, in theory you can start without a P-ROC and use a virtual machine instead. I gave up as I got too confused, plus I'm adding an autolauncher to my Tomcat which the VP table doesn't have and pinmame doesn't support. I think there are a few folks on the forum though who spent quite a while doing virtual development before they installed a P-ROC etc, so it's a "no-cash-outlay" way to start.
 
Like a rom selector on boot?

"P-ROC etc, so it's a "no-cash-outlay" way to start."

Yeah, it's going to be very good for testing the water and what it entails. I didn't know this was possible before, even though I had seen Destruk post that installer a while back and skimmed over it. I didn't use that package, but the one Gary posted.
 
[QUOTE="Snux, post: 64941, member: 182" I gave up as I got too confused[/QUOTE]

You weren't alone there! Ended up on two machines gone 12am. The instructions need to be a lot clearer. Hopefully I can figure this out.
 
The challenge is that only 2 or 3 people have ever done it. Feel free to add some more notes to the forum, maybe I'll be brave enough to try again sometime!
 
Oh dear, really. That makes me feel a bit better about it not being alone. Must of come close , but it doesn't even print the log which makes it difficult in trying to guess what's actually going on and missing.

Don't like to concede and will try again later.
 
You may have seen I have it running now Mark. Is your source closed ?
 
Yeah, I saw the grinning post on the forum - well done, and thanks for documenting what you did too.

My source is open, although all I have is the old stuff which is here :

https://github.com/Snux/F14-P-ROC

At the moment I don't have a working machine (since I'm waiting to get the playfield) and I don't think virtual will work for me (although you've got me interested in taking another look now!). When I did the above code I just jumped in without thinking very hard about the best way to put it together, so it's poorly structured. I'm going to start from scratch when I get going again, but will poke around the source for other folks projects and find a "base" that I like the most and then pinch it. Most of the development for P-ROC is open source, if you check out the various user projects in this sub-forum you'll find most people have posted links to their code and are happy for others to steal,borrow and copy!

http://www.pinballcontrollers.com/forum/index.php?board=17.0

Welcome to the madness! I have a feeling I'm going to try and get my F14 running virtually, I see a whole day disappearing soon :)

Mark
 
Oh cool, I didn't see you had a github for it. Thanks!

"Welcome to the madness! I have a feeling I'm going to try and get my F14 running virtually, I see a whole day disappearing soon :)"

Haha. Cheers.
I'll see if I can get it running in VP and pass it over if you need. It has to be a much faster way of working, especially setting the switches to keyboard presses rather than knocking the ball around or with your fingers to test.

"thanks for documenting what you did too."

No problem , I think I've managed to outline correctly where I'd gone wrong.

"I just jumped in without thinking very hard about the best way to put it together"

Yeah, that's pretty much what I'm going to have to do but you've gotta start somewhere. I've got an environment in Visual Studio going now as well so that's good for me as that's what I've been used to so far.

"if you check out the various user projects in this sub-forum you'll find most people have posted links to their code and are happy for others to steal,borrow and copy!"

Yes there will be a lot of digging around and trying to learn some more of this in coming weeks and I know no Python at all.
I'm really interested in the LCD way I've seen for the Buffy game. If I could turn a Robocop with video clips. :clap:

Will look at F-14 this evening. If it wasn't for this thread I would never of known! Cheers!
 
Ahh, so close. Will try again tomorrow. Tried with 2 VP table builds and it was the same.

Think it's some issue with the lamps maybe (attract). Not sure that you have to do anything special to the table either really for it to boot.

F14.py

self.trough = trough.Trough(game=self)
self.base_game_mode = BaseGameMode(game=self)
self.effects = effects.Effects(game=self)
self.tomcathurryup = F14modes.TomcatHurryup(game=self)
self.ramps = ramps.Ramps(game=self)
self.attract_mode = attract.Attract(game=self)
self.reset()

Crash on the self.reset(). If that's commented out the table boots with the dmd but think game needs to be able to complete the self.reset() to boot correctly.
 
Been reading your pinside thread, very impressive stuff. I hope your F-14 is going to visit some shows, it would be a pity to keep this all to yourself!
 
It won't make any shows this year as for sure it won't be ready, but I would like to get it to one next year. I still didn't make it the the Slam or the UKPP as the dates always clash with other things, but will try harder in 2015 :)
 
Possible silly q....

The sys11 and wpc switch matrix are different in their operation. The principle is the same but the electrically very different. I wonder how the P-ROC controller does things?

I guess this wont make any difference if you are 100% physical switches but may do if you start using optos etc.
 
Snux said:
It won't make any shows this year as for sure it won't be ready, but I would like to get it to one next year. I still didn't make it the the Slam or the UKPP as the dates always clash with other things, but will try harder in 2015 :)
Click to expand...
I know that problem well, everything is clashing with my shift pattern this year, slam, UKPP, various league meets and birthday bashes, I can only get so many shifts covered!....grrrrr.
 
abaxas said:
Possible silly q....

The sys11 and wpc switch matrix are different in their operation. The principle is the same but the electrically very different. I wonder how the P-ROC controller does things?

I guess this wont make any difference if you are 100% physical switches but may do if you start using optos etc.
Click to expand...
For WPC, the switches just connect up to the P-ROC without any changes required. The P-ROC is as happy with optos as anything else. On a Sys 11, the switch matrix also connects up to the P-ROC directly, using the same matrix connections as you'd use for WPC. The design of the matrix from that point of view is the same, 8 rows by 8 columns with a diode on each switch. Works just fine. On the few Sys11 machines that have optos, the opto board appears on the matrix just like any other switch and the P-ROC handles it just fine.

Electrically the WPC matrix runs on 5v and the Sys11 on 12v. You can use either on the P-ROC, you can have it supply 12v or 5v. Actually 5v works just fine on the Sys11 matrix too, I think everyone who has P-ROC / Sys11 uses 5v without problems. The only little change we make for Sys11 to P-ROC is that on the Sys11 the switch matrix connectors are .156 and the headers on the P-ROC (like WPC) are 0.1, so we have to make a small adapter.

Hope that makes sense!
 
Optos might have a separate supply, not sure. But with the P-ROC in WPC/Stern you only swap out the CPU board. All the other boards (drivers, power supplies, optos) stay where they are. P-ROC only does the CPU work. For Sys11 you have to remove the MPU and replace with a P-ROC and a new driver board, but the other boards also stay in place (optos, power supply, flipper etc).

As for the voltage, could be 5v or 12v I've not checked, but works without issues anyway.
 
Been a while since the last post, mainly because from a 'shop log' perspective I'm still waiting (sigh...) for PPS to release the new repro playfields. So my physical F14 machine looks pretty much the same as it did a couple of months back (except it has more junk stacked on/in it at thje moment). From a virtual perspective though, the new software is coming along nicely. Just posted an update to my pinside thread if anyone is interested. More to come here on the shop side once I get playfield :)

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/t...-and-on-going-development/page/2#post-1854296
 
Look what I found .....

PA103971_zpsb54e4a1e.jpg

Ron Kruzman in the US has this NOS F-14 playfield. It's been cleared previously but needs some more work to get it completely finished. Paid him for it and the work he needs to do, so now I can start planning my winter's work :)
 
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