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so here it is.... NERG roll call

A quick question for @Big Phil and others who are helping out at NERG. I'm bringing a game in the back of the car but not sure which one it should be. The choice is either Fathom as it works and survived fine at 8 bit flip or my newly acquired Fireball EM.

I'd quite like to bring Fireball as you don't see them at shows very often and I've just given it a quick clean up so it's playing well. The issue is that there's a problem with it where if it's left on for a little while it trips the RCD in my consumer unit at home. I'm assuming it's a simple thing to sort out as the game seems to work fine other than this so my question is whether there will be anyone at NERG who can help fix this issue as it's unlikely I'll get chance to look at it before the weekend? I generally don't like to bring a game to a show that's got a known issue but thought I'd check what people think and whether anyone might be able to help get it sorted...whoever is looking after the electrics maybe?

Thoughts?
 
ronsplooter said:
A quick question for @Big Phil and others who are helping out at NERG. I'm bringing a game in the back of the car but not sure which one it should be. The choice is either Fathom as it works and survived fine at 8 bit flip or my newly acquired Fireball EM.

I'd quite like to bring Fireball as you don't see them at shows very often and I've just given it a quick clean up so it's playing well. The issue is that there's a problem with it where if it's left on for a little while it trips the RCD in my consumer unit at home. I'm assuming it's a simple thing to sort out as the game seems to work fine other than this so my question is whether there will be anyone at NERG who can help fix this issue as it's unlikely I'll get chance to look at it before the weekend? I generally don't like to bring a game to a show that's got a known issue but thought I'd check what people think and whether anyone might be able to help get it sorted...whoever is looking after the electrics maybe?

Thoughts?
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I wouldn't if I were you, tracing out the reason for tripping an RCD is not usually a five minute job. You most likely have a leakage to earth, which can sometimes be failing transformer insulation, causing arcing to the frame when warmed up.
 
i'd bring the fathom mate.re fireball do some rudimentary checks like checking whole length of flex for ANY damage,and checking make offs in plug and the machine end.if it was mine i would probably just buy 4m of 2mm or 1.5mm three core flex,and replace that cable.that's a start.just to reiterate it is the rcd tripping and not the cb?
 
Chris, IMHO take a game that you feel confident will last out. Then you can relax and think about playing the other folks' games and not worry about fixing yours. And your fathom would go very nicely next to my vector

image.jpg
 
I'm only going to manage an hour on Sunday I'm at the England ODI all day Saturday and have agreed to go to Whitby for Father's Day on Sunday! Nightmare
 
Not going to make it as i'll have the mother of all headaches/hangovers after the Foo's in Wembley on Saturday.... :D
 
Fathom it is :thumbs:

You most likely have a leakage to earth, which can sometimes be failing transformer insulation, causing arcing to the frame when warmed up
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I tested again tonight and it took about half an hour before it tripped the RCD (i played a couple of games in that time and just left it in attract for the rest). It also does it when the game is plugged into the wall and switched on at the socket but not switched on at the cab switch. I'm guessing the only things between the socket in this scenario are the plug, cable, transformer and cab switch so it's got to be something to do with one of them?

replace that cable.that's a start.just to reiterate it is the rcd tripping and not the cb?
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Visually the cable looks ok but continuity from the plug pins to the input side of the transformer is a bit rough so I should probably replace it like you say, at least it eliminates that. It's tripping the breaker in my consumer unit labelled "RCD Controlled Circuits" not the one labelled "Sockets" if that tells you anything?
 
send me a pic of it
if it has a test button and 30mA on it,then it's an rcd
BTW i would unplug or at least turn socket off for the mo
 
In that case you more than likely have something leaking to earth. I think (from what i remember - i'm sure someone will correct me) if you have more than 20ma current flowing to earth then the RCD trips.. However the Trip will remain in tact because there's not enough current being drawn to trip it :D
 
TYHO said:
i'd bring the fathom mate.re fireball do some rudimentary checks like checking whole length of flex for ANY damage,and checking make offs in plug and the machine end.if it was mine i would probably just buy 4m of 2mm or 1.5mm three core flex,and replace that cable.that's a start.just to reiterate it is the rcd tripping and not the cb?
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meant 1mm or 1.5mm
 
The plug and power cable on my fathom were both damaged and dangerous. As these are "outside the pinball machine" and subjected to stupidity and damage, I would replace these up to whère the 240v line is soldered into your machine. Put a smoke detector nearby !

Could you do a continuity/ diode test when it has popped the RCd to see if there is a short ? Then replace the power cable and plug to see if it cures it

At least your machine is displaying the fault regularly which should help you find it

I would stay close to it when plugged in, just to be safe
 
ronsplooter said:
I tested again tonight and it took about half an hour before it tripped the RCD (i played a couple of games in that time and just left it in attract for the rest). It also does it when the game is plugged into the wall and switched on at the socket but not switched on at the cab switch. I'm guessing the only things between the socket in this scenario are the plug, cable, transformer and cab switch so it's got to be something to do with one of them?
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Well that's probably a good scenario for you then, as it is going to be a fault in the less expensive category then.


When the switch is off, the only things in the circuit are, the mains lead itself, the line filter, the MOV (where fitted) and the power switch itself.

One of those things has a leak from live to earth, its quite likely it is going to be the line filter. Line filters are required to fail open circuit, but they older ones don't always fail gracefully.
 
If its any consolation they were awesome at Slane...

im guessing its not though..

Rained from 5pm and was still raining at 11:30 when we got back to the car. completely soaked but worth it
 
if it has a test button and 30mA on it,then it's an rcd
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It has both of these things so must be an rcd :thumbs:

BTW i would unplug or at least turn socket off for the mo
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I would stay close to it when plugged in, just to be safe
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It only stays plugged in if I'm messing with it, off and unplugged the rest of time :)

When the switch is off, the only things in the circuit are, the mains lead itself, the line filter, the MOV (where fitted) and the power switch itself.
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Cool, is there a line filter on an EM this old and any idea where it might be? From what I can see the mains cable is hooked up directly to the transformer with nothing in between. I'll try and get some pics up tonight :thumbs: Also, what's a MOV? :)
 
ronsplooter said:
It has both of these things so must be an rcd :thumbs:




It only stays plugged in if I'm messing with it, off and unplugged the rest of time :)



Cool, is there a line filter on an EM this old and any idea where it might be? From what I can see the mains cable is hooked up directly to the transformer with nothing in between. I'll try and get some pics up tonight :thumbs: Also, what's a MOV? :)
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Yes, although I guess they are often retrofitted on the older games.

So great, you are making progress already, if you trace the mains lead into the cab, and there is no line filter or MOV (MOV is a circle disc across the Live and Neutral that shorts out if there are voltage spikes) then all you have is a mains lead and switch, and if the fault exists with the switch off, then the fault is with the switch or the cable. The live will be disconnected from the transformer when the switch is off (unless it is wired backwards) so it is not likely to be the transformer now.

Personally I like to put new mains leads on all my cabs (as most are in a terrible state, and I like the mains side of all my games to be safe) so I would probably go that route, if after replacing the mains lead the fault still exists, then it's got to be the switch arcing to the casing inside (maybe also check that the wires to the swtich are not worn and potentially brushing the casing of the switch



Personally I like to
 
Thanks @lukewells I had a quick look at the wiring to the cab switch and it wasn't the greatest. I'll get a new mains lead fitted and see about tidying up the switch wiring and see if that changes anything :thumbs:
 
replicas said:
So is it NERG then ?
Only asking as I have a backbox with your name on it here and thought it could be a ideal time to hand it back to you.
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nah he'll wimp out rather than getting a "proper"hangover with us at NERG
 
Yup - Wimping out this time. No cash, and to be honest after the 1200 miles ive done this week, i could do without the additional 500 :(

However it's summer @replicas - i'll be up soon (next few weeks hopefully if you are about :)
 
Wish I could make this, have a splendid weekend everyone, dont do anything I wouldnt
 
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