What's new
By:
Pinball info

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Help needed - TOM left side GI

jonathan

jonathan

Site Supporter
10 Years
Joined
Jul 21, 2011
Messages
3,611
Location
Newcastle
The GI on the left side of the pf has gone out. I opened up the backbox and the fuse had blown and 2 pins on the connector were black. I've replaced the fuse but no joy. Any ideas? I don't know if the connector was already black?

Thanks
 
Ok so I replaced fuses 109 and 110 and the GI came back on. F109 and the connector below are getting red got however, hence the black pins on the connector? Any ideas why 2 pins and a fuse would be overheating?
 
there could be a high resistance on the board or if triac controlled a problem there but dont know if it is on that game
 
I'm not familiar with TOM although I did have a quick skim through the manual. Which connector is getting hot and blackened? These fuses are sections #1 and #2 of the GI, of which there are 5 altogether. Both J120 and J121 are directly below F109 and F110 and both are for the GI, although J121 is for the playfield, so I'm guessing that's the one causing trouble.

It could be a poor connection on one of the connector pins. That would create a high resistance connection which could then overheat. Pull the connectors off and clean up the header pins (fibreglass pencil is good at this) and then make sure the sockets in the connector are clean too (a bit trickier with these - the ideal is to replace them). When you reseat the connectors make sure that each pin is fully seated as sometimes they slip of of the housing.

But also make sure there isn't a short in the GI circuit. Some metal worked loose, causing a slight short and causing too much current to draw?

img_f.pinside.com_201404_1600155_221172.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: JT.
jonathan said:
img.photobucket.com_albums_v640_spartanheed_060CAA22_07AC_44A4_90E0_291FEAFAABED_zpstoa3oams.jpg
Click to expand...

Ok. Easy to see the problem. Nasty wiring. Chop back the ends of both wires a couple of inches and re-insert into the connectors using the proper IDC (Insulation Displacement Connector) tool. There is no need to strip the wires first.

Personally I'd ditch the IDC connector and fit proper Molex connectors with Trifurcon pins, especially as these are power connectors. Look at the photo I posted above. Notice F120 and F121 have different (and very clean!) connector housing with pins inside? Get some of those :D
 
If you do re-use that connector make sure you chop off the best 2 pins and don't re-use the burnt section ;)

But it looks as though it's been a problem before because 4 of the F120 header pins have been replaced (black without clips instead of white). It also looks like there's a little scorching on the PCB too? Could be worth taking the board out and checking the soldering/connectors on the back.
 
Hate to state what,to me seems obvious.Check pinball suppliers in the uk.Sometimes ya need to help yourself dude
Extra hint

look on pinmania and pinheaven

No need to say that to Dan,I imagine he is thinking along the same lines
I will always try and help people,tho sometimes ya really do need to try a little bit yourself

For the record I like the metal type re longevity,but for average pinhead,plastic will work fine.
Sure if ya contact either,they can bring to NLP
 
I searched eBay for 'idc tool', made sense to me. Thanks for the reply, I'll get one ordered
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: JT.
Jonathan,

All the parts you need are available from Pinball Mania:

http://www.pinballmania.co.uk/pcbparts.htm

Under the 0.156" Connectors - IDC section. Whilst getting an insertion tool throw caution to the wind and treat yourself to a whole new connector block!

If you're feeling really adventurous and know which is the hot end of a soldering iron you could really push the boat out and get a whole new row of header pins for the PCB! ;)

Oh, don't forget to ditch the 5A domestic plug fuse and get the correct fuses from Pinball Mania too. I think Andy (@pinballmania) pretty much does them all. If you're not 100% sure what the correct fuses are double check the manual and shoot Andy an email stating game, board and fuse number and I'm sure he'll be able to advise.

£10-20 well spent on your £2k pinball machine! TOM is a fantastic game - keep it running in tip top condition :D

Regards,

Peter
 
I have seen people solder to new idc plugs
some frown on that,tho I suspect if a nice joint,it will make better contact than the idc!!
 
Nedreud said:
Jonathan,

All the parts you need are available from Pinball Mania:

http://www.pinballmania.co.uk/pcbparts.htm

Under the 0.156" Connectors - IDC section. Whilst getting an insertion tool throw caution to the wind and treat yourself to a whole new connector block!

If you're feeling really adventurous and know which is the hot end of a soldering iron you could really push the boat out and get a whole new row of header pins for the PCB! ;)

Oh, don't forget to ditch the 5A domestic plug fuse and get the correct fuses from Pinball Mania too. I think Andy (@pinballmania) pretty much does them all. If you're not 100% sure what the correct fuses are double check the manual and shoot Andy an email stating game, board and fuse number and I'm sure he'll be able to advise.

£10-20 well spent on your £2k pinball machine! TOM is a fantastic game - keep it running in tip top condition :D

Regards,

Peter
Click to expand...


Agreed,may as well change the header pins.a bit of a ball ache yes,but if a keeper worth it for a game worth around £2k.A solder sucker an iron will do the trick,tho you can always use a desolder station but to most not worth the £80 outlay.
I have a solder sucker,desolder station and also solder wick.I actually like solder wick for cleaning up small holes-I prefer chemtronics as other solder wicks don't seem as good.
 
TYHO said:
I have seen people solder to new idc plugs
some frown on that,tho I suspect if a nice joint,it will make better contact than the idc!!
Click to expand...

I agree @TYHO. It probably makes a bit of mess of the plastic at the top but solder for the win every time. If you were in a spot and didn't have a new connector I'd try a spot of solder on an iffy IDC.

But for the win I go with Trifurcon pins which I then solder on. Frankly, I find it quicker, easier and better than crimping. They're also easier to take off and replace at a later date too. Double win.
 
Molex would be my preference too. Better conductivity = less chance of setting things on fire :)
I did hear though that soldering the trifurcon pins ADDS resistance, so if you can manage by just making a solid crimp, it should be better.
 
Never tried a desoldering station. They look good but the ones I've seen are so expensive. My solder sucker has done me proud since my Maplin days :p
 
Wizcat said:
I did hear though that soldering the trifurcon pins ADDS resistance.
Click to expand...

I'd love to see the scientific and experimental evidence for that. Having done a bit of the old physics and electronics at university I can't see how a metal bond between clean copper, nickel and solder would create a junction of higher resistance than crimping? The flux from the solder removes oxidation from the surface of the metal, so even if it wasn't soldered, it would be cleaner, and therefore less resistive than crimping alone. Soldering creates a greater area of near perfect contact and thus lower resistance.

That's just the physicist inside me talking. Uni was a long time ago though and I did drink quite a lot of Newcastle Brown in those days ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: JT.
Nedreud said:
Jonathan,

All the parts you need are available from Pinball Mania:

http://www.pinballmania.co.uk/pcbparts.htm

Under the 0.156" Connectors - IDC section. Whilst getting an insertion tool throw caution to the wind and treat yourself to a whole new connector block!

If you're feeling really adventurous and know which is the hot end of a soldering iron you could really push the boat out and get a whole new row of header pins for the PCB! ;)

Oh, don't forget to ditch the 5A domestic plug fuse and get the correct fuses from Pinball Mania too. I think Andy (@pinballmania) pretty much does them all. If you're not 100% sure what the correct fuses are double check the manual and shoot Andy an email stating game, board and fuse number and I'm sure he'll be able to advise.

£10-20 well spent on your £2k pinball machine! TOM is a fantastic game - keep it running in tip top condition :D

Regards,

Peter
Click to expand...

Great post - are you really in the USA at the moment Peter like your profile country suggests?
 
Nedreud said:
I'd love to see the scientific and experimental evidence for that...
Click to expand...
Having just googled it, I agree! Didn't realise it was such a minefield of conflicting opinion. The arguments against soldering seem to include : the flux is going to be near impossible to clean up (and can corrode connection), heat makes the wire brittle, solder has poor electrical performance. Arguments for seem to mainly focus on the mechanical strength

Solder is certainly less conductive than copper though (correct me if I'm wrong?) so by that reasoning crimping should be the more conductive (better) option?
 
JT. said:
Great post - are you really in the USA at the moment Peter like your profile country suggests?
Click to expand...
No, my feet are most definitely quite firmly planted in Ol' Blighty! It's just because when I work from home I use a VPN (Virtual Private Connection - a secure encrypted tunnel) to servers located in the USA so the IP address that pinballinfo.com sees me coming from is US-based. Aside from work it's dead handy for watching US-only TV shows. I wanted to watch the TRON animated series which is available on Disney XD but only in the US but I can when I'm on the VPN :D
 
  • Like
Reactions: JT.
Wizcat said:
Having just googled it, I agree! Didn't realise it was such a minefield of conflicting opinion. The arguments against soldering seem to include : the flux is going to be near impossible to clean up (and can corrode connection), heat makes the wire brittle, solder has poor electrical performance. Arguments for seem to mainly focus on the mechanical strength

Solder is certainly less conductive than copper though (correct me if I'm wrong?) so by that reasoning crimping should be the more conductive (better) option?
Click to expand...
Good quality solder has good quality flux. There's nothing to clean up if done properly. Corrosion associated with flux is mostly to do with acid-based flux but the solder for electronics uses rosin-based flux that minimises this problem. Whilst repeated heating and rapid cooling will anneal a metal, a few seconds with an iron at a couple of hundred degrees is nothing compared to the process it went through to be made into wire. If solder is such a poor conductor why is used to "glue" every component onto a PCB, including he most minute SMDs (Surface Mount Devices)? Solder is a good conductor. Not as good as copper but still very good (copper is an exceptional conductor). The union of a good solder joint between two pieces of copper can be considered for all practical purposes to be a continuation of the copper itself. Any variation in conductivity is many magnitudes smaller than say the differences in tolerances of the components being connected, for example.

As for crimping, when done well, and that means using the right tool to apply sufficient pressure to produce a gas-tight cold union, is every bit as good as soldering. There are pros and cons to to both. Generally, smaller wires are best soldered and larger wires (like the stuff as thick as your finger in car audio systems) is best crimped (mainly because soldering wire that thick needs a gas torch and usually incinerates nearby insulation sleeving). Crimped connections on large wires have great mechanical properties, i.e., they're less prone to vibration issues compared to screw terminals.

But in the context of pinball a well-done solder is as good as a well-done crimp. The key to either is it being well-done. Learning and practicing your technique! I've never been that good at crimping, probably because I haven't brought myself to spend £50-100 on a decent crimping tool. However, I'm a dab hand with my trusty 25W iron and some 60/40 PbSn so my soldered connections are far better!

Each to their own basically ;) Just do it right and do it well!
 
I think so, I did a botch job to check it worked. Now need to order new fuses, connector block, idc tool etc. and do the job properly. Thanks for everyone's help
 
sweet
If at NLP get the bits ordered and pick up there
If not get ordered and bits delivered then fixed;)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom