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Experiences with my first pin, by skweek aged 29 and 3/4

skweek

skweek

Registered
10 Years
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
162
Location
Sarf East Lahndahn!
Right, not really sure where to put this as it's not entirely tech related or really a shop log (I was going to hijack Dan's shop log thread but I though that might make things confusing.) but thought I'd start a thread with what's going on with my new toy and my experiences of being a newbie! Also, I think writing it all down will help me clarify and remember what I'm doing. :)

So, I now own a lovely Rollergames! I've actually had it a while but it finally made it's way to my new home last week. (It's this one: http://www.pinballinfo.com/community/threads/rollergames-shop-log.2211/) I bought it for many reasons, me and the Mrs both like it, it survived the LPC without any major problems (apart from the fuse for some of the coils blowing) and most importantly it was cheap! :)

It's been at my parent's house for a bit and my Dad has been playing great without any major problems but in typical pinball fashion, less than 24 hours after getting it home and having a few terrible games (I blame the fact I haven't levelled it 100%) the lower right flipper died and the right flipper went lazy. I had a look under the playfield and saw that the linkage had shattered, so I ordered lots of bits and bobs to fix this and all the other little niggles I have with it. Oh and some Novus, lovely lovely Novus. :cool:

Today all the parts arrived! Wooo yay! Now to go and fix things!

Here's my hitlist at the moment :

Replace flipper linkage
Replace right flipper coil with correct coil
Install plunger sleeve
Sort out contacts on the lamp boards / bulb holder
Investigate why a couple of the flashers don't work
Sort the magnet (I know, I know)
Give it a clean
Replace missing rubbers / screws / nuts etc
Investigate the upper diverter occasionally misfiring
and anything else I find along the way or that gets suggested.

Oh, and get really really good at pinball!

If this belongs somewhere else, feel free to move it!

I think that's about it for now, I'll report back when I've blown myself up. ;)
 
Not sure where this goes yet so lets see how it pans out. It might become a shop log if you post enough pictures.
Good for you getting stuck in like this. It was how it started for me and a year later I now have three machines, so be warned it is addictive.
Metal does fatigue over time my Addams base plates all broke, one by one over the first few months. IJ's looks fine for now...

Take lots of pictures, for you and us, we like pictures. :)
 
Yeah, I keep meaning to take pictures. The only problem is the only decent camera I've got is a 5D and I'm a bit too lazy to convert from RAW, resize and upload photos. :)

In other news, coil and flipper linkage replaced and nothing blew up. As I had the flipper assembly in bits i thought I might as well replace the coil while I was in there. That was pretty easy!

GO FOR THE WALL!
 
skweek said:
Yeah, I keep meaning to take pictures. The only problem is the only decent camera I've got is a 5D and I'm a bit too lazy to convert from RAW, resize and upload photos. :)

In other news, coil and flipper linkage replaced and nothing blew up. As I had the flipper assembly in bits i thought I might as well replace the coil while I was in there. That was pretty easy!

GO FOR THE WALL!
Click to expand...


Congrats on the purchase and welcome to the insanity :) It is addictive - I now have 12 with one more on the way.
If you get stuck post on here or the ukyahoo group and I am sure people will help.They may even be nearby to pop round and help.
Best of luck

Now this next bit is not directed to you but just a general comment..
Just my opinion here but I read all the time people changing coils which for me seems a waste of money.So long as its resistance is correct you are better off using the coil money say £10,and replacing the flipper nylon and crank bushings and just the coil sleeve on both sides for the same price.These are the bits that wear but a fair few people dont replace them
 
TYHO said:
Now this next bit is not directed to you but just a general comment..
Just my opinion here but I read all the time people changing coils which for me seems a waste of money.So long as its resistance is correct you are better off using the coil money say £10,and replacing the flipper nylon and crank bushings and just the coil sleeve on both sides for the same price.These are the bits that wear but a fair few people dont replace them
Click to expand...

Totally agree. Unless the coil has had a catastrophic failure and toasted itself to death , which isn't hard to spot ;), then they are generally fine. I have rebuilt oodles of flippers over the years and dont remember needing new coils on any of them.
 
Another person agreeing here. I now only replace coils when they are wrong or damaged. I keep the wrong ones in a box to use later, they can always be re-papered as RudeDog demonstrates.
The flipper rebuild, plus bushes makes so much difference to flipper power. All lessons to be learnt.
 
Oh, I agree with not changing the coil if it's not needed. I only changed it because it was the wrong strength and didn't match the one next to it, can't be having differently powered left and right flippers! Might have been a waste of time/money but it's made me happy and that's all I really care about. Also, it's practice for when something does go really wrong and now I've got a spare coil! :)

In other news, I think I've fixed the magnet issue, changed the angle of flange/nubbin/whatchamacallit on the end pit ramp and it seems to catch the ball every time now, who knows though!

Also, missing post sleeves have been put on, plunger sleeve is in, replaced a few bulbs. Working from home is great! ;)

Oh and the main thing I've discovered is that all of this is really enjoyable and at the end of it all you get to play pinball on a fully working machine!
 
Looking forward to hearing all about how you get on with your Rollergames.

I too have a Rollergames which I bought as a non working game at last year's Pinball Party. After stripping and cleaning the game last autumn, and getting the game more or less working, the game ended up getting dumped in the back of the garage after my recent house move.

It's blowing flipper fuses and it needs a few more parts before it's playable.I need to get this game sorted , I just love the music on it!
 
Skweek, those are the reasons I change coils and practice is never a bad thing.
Well done on fixing that catch magnet, it had Dan going a little mad (only a little as he was a lot mad to start with).
I like a day of playing, fixing and playing. It is the reason they breed as you don't want to stop being able to play but also like fixing. So you buy a second one to fix whilst you can still play the first and then fix it so now you have two to play. Getting a third is easier to justify than getting the second as it is only a 33% increase...
 
I'm sorry but everything has a life cycle even coils, every flip brings it closer to death. so, change the bloody coil you cheap skates. I replace everything when rebuilding the flips, bushes and grommets included.
 
skweek said:
I only changed it because it was the wrong strength and didn't match the one next to it, can't be having differently powered left and right flippers!
Click to expand...

Some later games with solid-state flipper control do have differently rated coils on the main flipper units. It's usually when one flipper has an enormous ramp to shoot for, e.g. Creature from Black Lagoon, WhiteWater.
 
bartron said:
I'm sorry but everything has a life cycle even coils, every flip brings it closer to death. so, change the bloody coil you cheap skates. I replace everything when rebuilding the flips, bushes and grommets included.
Click to expand...

**** all about being a cheapskate-plastic bushings and metal bushings wear and get elongated and fook up the mechanics of a game.
If a game coil is still the required resistance there is absolutely no need to change it.
If you wanna spunk unnecessary money on summat that's up to you but for me I will only change something when it is wrong.Dont get me wrong I spunk money on pins and some bling but not when it dont electrically require it
 
Robin, one thing i just remembered - i think the four leaf switches inside the slingshots are all a bit knackered, i noticed this when i had it all stripped down for cleaning. i was gonna replace them but got distracted by something else and ended up just mangling them back into shape. if they're still working fine then forget it, but i suspect you're probably enjoying this and may like the task. should be a simple enough job and plenty satisfying
 
Jay Walker said:
Some later games with solid-state flipper control do have differently rated coils on the main flipper units. It's usually when one flipper has an enormous ramp to shoot for, e.g. Creature from Black Lagoon, WhiteWater.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I did check the manual before swapping it over!

Got an odd one with one of the flashers, they all seem to work fine apart from one that is suck on all the time when the A/C select relay is in on the C side. Everything else on the machine works fine but it didn't have a bulb in it when I got it and I did try one of the other flash bulbs in there before touching anything else on the machine. I was thinking some sort of short to ground somewhere in the ramp assembly if my understanding of the way coils / flashers work is correct. They're powered all the time and are switched to ground when the when they fire and the A/C relay is on the correct side, right?

Any ideas before I start pulling things apart? I don't really want to have to pull the whole playfield out and disassemble the ramp assembly to check all the wires if it could be something else that's easy to check first! I'll need to pull it out to get to the diverter to have a look at that but that's a job for another day as it's working fairly well and I don't want to fix something that isn't broken. :)
 
cooldan said:
Robin, one thing i just remembered - i think the four leaf switches inside the slingshots are all a bit knackered, i noticed this when i had it all stripped down for cleaning. i was gonna replace them but got distracted by something else and ended up just mangling them back into shape. if they're still working fine then forget it, but i suspect you're probably enjoying this and may like the task. should be a simple enough job and plenty satisfying
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, the slingshots are something else I mean to look at, they work fine at the moment but the plastics are a bit warped making them a little sluggish.
 
Yip, we have a winner! Transistor Q30 is bad, just tested it out with my meter.

I'll have to get a replacement and fit it, it's a TIP122 that I can replace with a TIP102 yeah? Looks like a trip to the RS trade counter tomorrow is on the agenda then!
 
In the honor of what GrizZ did for me last week. PM me your address, I will send one to you first class now, it may arrive by tomorrow morning.

I have both TIP122 and TIP102, I am told they are interchangeable.
 
skweek said:
Yeah, I did check the manual before swapping it over!

I'll need to pull it out to get to the diverter to have a look at that but that's a job for another day as it's working fairly well and I don't want to fix something that isn't broken. :)
Click to expand...

Yes, Rollergames has a 'Red' coil on each flipper, doesn't it? That was the standard issue until solid-state control came along.

Your RG probably has the later type of diverter linkage, then; a flat metal bar pinned directly into the coil plunger. I was glad to see the back of the early type, with an extension spring between them, like on the 'lock release' diverter mechanism. Each time the spring broke, which was often, the playfield came out in order to reach the ramp diverter. Addams Family suffers from the same spring breaking, but it doesn't affect play to the same degree. However, Riverboat Gambler, which uses the spring on the roulette wheel diverter, ends up with all three balls sitting on the diverter when the spring breaks.
 
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Thanks, dan

I'm in Swansea, but worked as a repairman in the Kingston-on-Thames/Surrey area, so maybe we'd have a few sites in common.
 
Jay Walker said:
Yes, Rollergames has a 'Red' coil on each flipper, doesn't it? That was the standard issue until solid-state control came along.

Your RG probably has the later type of diverter linkage, then; a flat metal bar pinned directly into the coil plunger. I was glad to see the back of the early type, with an extension spring between them, like on the 'lock release' diverter mechanism. Each time the spring broke, which was often, the playfield came out in order to reach the ramp diverter. Addams Family suffers from the same spring breaking, but it doesn't seem to affect play to the same degree.
Click to expand...

Nah, it's got an extension spring on it. Well, it has in the manual and it has and extension spring on the actual machine. It's a double diverter and it seems to sometimes fire too slowly and sometimes fire too quickly. I'll possibly have a look at it later today as it's a real pain using up your magnet to lock a ball and then the ball doesn't actually make it to the lock or bounces back round and down the ramp. It is missing it's master spring and the e-clip associated with it though, so that might have something to do with it...
 
Gah, typed a nice long reply to this and lost it by going back in the browser!

So, here we go again. Are we sitting comfortably? Then I'll begin! ;)

Diverter gave up diverting completely today, so I had a little look and one of the coil wires had decided it didn't want to be friends with the coil anymore. Soldered that back on and while I was there stuck a replacement for the master spring and an e-clip on and had a look at why the extension spring didn't look like it was meant to be in the position it was in. Turns out the roll pin and one of the screws for the coil retaining bracket were missing so I've put the missing screw back and bodged the spring in a different way for now just to get it working. Seems to work slightly better now so I may just leave that alone for now as it's working 99% of the time. Woo, yay, etc!

And there was much rejoicing as a ball was diverted from the plunge.

Had a look at the upper right flipper as it felt a bit weak, especially when trying to flip from the magnet and the coil sleeve was impossible to remove and impossible to replace (guessing the coil bobin must have warped through heat?) so I've swapped it out with the blue coil that I replaced on the bottom right flipper. It's much smoother now and feels a lot better, I might just keep it like that for now, unless it's going to shatter the ramp or tear a hole in the fabric of space.

And there was further merriment as a ball was successfully shot up the ramp after being captured by the magnet.

I've also had the CPU board out and replaced the transistor that I thought was faulty, turns out it wasn't (Silly me! Next time I'll remember to test a bit more meticulously, but hey this this is a learning experience right?) as I tested the new one with the meter after replacing it and it tested out fine, no short to ground. However, the short to ground still exists when I put it back in the machine and connect all the cables correctly. If I disconnect 1J11 from the CPU board (which connects to J1 from the Aux Power board) it then isn't shorted to ground. My thoughts are something's up on the Aux Power board or further down the chain but if I disconnect all the other cables from the Aux Power board then the short is still there. Any ideas before I carry on? Have I got the completely wrong end of the stick?

And there was much sulking in the land until our hero remembered he could just put everything back together and play some pinball!

Aside from this one single flasher being a problem and what I'd consider normal maintenance issues, it's playing great and I got a new highscore of 18 million odd earlier. No idea how long I've spent fiddling with it but it doesn't seem like too long so far and it's not become a chore yet, which is good! :)
 
From what you've said the Aux board is causing a short so there must be a fault on it... :D

Well done with sorting the other issues!
 
Thanks!

Haven't had time to take a good look at the Aux board but I did get so annoyed with some light being out on the figure of eight track I took the light board out for it and re-did all the pads on it. Works lovely now but working with 20 year old solder isn't very easy! :)
 
skweek said:
Thanks!

Haven't had time to take a good look at the Aux board but I did get so annoyed with some light being out on the figure of eight track I took the light board out for it and re-did all the pads on it. Works lovely now but working with 20 year old solder isn't very easy! :)
Click to expand...

Keep plugging away - its funwhen ya fix all the faults-really:)Agree with Pet,it does sound like the aux board
Re coil i would put proper coil in
 
Right, quick update on this.

Found what I think is the fault with the locked on flasher, had the Aux Power Driver board out, and probed around with my meter and it turns out that the TIP36C at Q3 on the board is no good. So I'll get one (well 5) of them ordered and replace it. If that fixes it then everything (on the playfield at least, still need to get a coil and the missing connector for the knocker) will be 100% working I think!

There's a couple of little bodges I've noticed on the way but they're not major so I'll just leave them I think. The two main ones I can think of are that someone has used a bit of mains cable to fix the backbox GI at some point and at some point in it's life someone has replaced the A/C select relay but had to put some jumper wires in when they did it as the traces on the board are screwed.

Apart from that not much else has changed, I did swap out the plunger on the ramp diverter for one that had a roll pin in it as it's a pain to get to if it does fail again as you have to have the whole playfield out.

Oh, and I've temporarily removed the centre post and outlane star posts to make it a bit harder, because I'm weird like that.
 
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