So what would you prefer, a good looking restoration or an early stages of tiring but 100% original?
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Restoration v Original
- Thread starter Marcel
- Start date
Whichever plays the best
Been amazing loooking restored games but play like poop, and vice versa
Been amazing loooking restored games but play like poop, and vice versa
D
Deleted member 2463
A remake!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
original everytime.
Prefer nice originals. But manny did some good work. Not keen on rotten dog boards either.
OP
OP
I've heard of manny, did he restore cabinets? How did he cope with decals, did he do his own artwork?
Original every time but they're getting harder to find in 'mint' condition. The perfect senario is a restore that's done to a very high standard and not corners cut see it in the dark for a few seconds it passes as a nice machine. There's some great guys on here that can do fantastic work I've seen pf work by Chris p that is beautiful and he is on your doorstep chris b does fantastic full restores as well. Pinball heaven has fully restored pins that are to die for, if you went to NLP you'll of seen some of the restored pins on his stand, just beautiful.
OP
OP
I thought, Chris b was part of pinball heaven. What's NLP mate, is it annual?Original every time but they're getting harder to find in 'mint' condition. The perfect senario is a restore that's done to a very high standard and not corners cut see it in the dark for a few seconds it passes as a nice machine. There's some great guys on here that can do fantastic work I've seen pf work by Chris p that is beautiful and he is on your doorstep chris b does fantastic full restores as well. Pinball heaven has fully restored pins that are to die for, if you went to NLP you'll of seen some of the restored pins on his stand, just beautiful.
Agree Chris B does fantastic work.
R
RobZombie
Original. I really aren't a fan of the way the decals end up wrinkling on a lot of these restorations. But it's almost impossible to find certain games in nice original condition.
OP
OP
Yep that's a problem
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Mint original where possible and great if you can find unfaded screen printed cabinets.
Generally speaking, find a really nice looking original game and you can always get it to play near factory as there is so much less wear on components.
But a game like WH20 is almost impossible to find like this. So a really nice restoration, with the new Stern leg protectors to stop wrinkles is lovely.
Generally speaking, find a really nice looking original game and you can always get it to play near factory as there is so much less wear on components.
But a game like WH20 is almost impossible to find like this. So a really nice restoration, with the new Stern leg protectors to stop wrinkles is lovely.
Manny all the way, better than original, the ultimate mod . Very expensive though as he put lots of time and craftsmanship into it( as do others like Chris and hiro),
or if you can not afford it go with a remake not to mannys standard but a nice copy nonetheless .
or if you can not afford it go with a remake not to mannys standard but a nice copy nonetheless .
[Subsequent to posting this it transpires that I do not have a fully manufactured Manny cab, rather I have a Manny repaired and re-decalled cab ...]
Right now I have a Manny cab fish tales sat alongside an original Williams fish tales cab. I am making the best I can out of two very nice Fish tales.
The Manny cab was made with tremendous care. It must have taken him ages to build it. It is streets ahead of a bashed up original.
The Williams cab has manufacturing imperfections. The Manny cab has manufacturing imperfections. They are both made of plywood so this is inevitable.
The Williams cabs have lasted decades, will the Manny cabs ? Only time will tell.
The repro fish tales decals are showing signs of bubbling on the bolt holes and where the caster is attached. The decals lack the texture of the originals, they feel too smooth.
Manny cab ..
The sun over the start button is in the wrong place. I need to put a USA style coin door on to hide white bits of decal as this is also badly designed.
Manny cab ...
The orange shading is not right and has an artificial line in it. Look at the horizontal line forming a triangle above the start button.
Manny ....
Faded original ...
I have had to reroute some braid wires as these interfered with the playfield slide mechanism. Not all bolts through the cab were braided. No biggie. Did not take me long.
The corners are just tighter and look better on the original. The original does not have prominent white edges either.
Manny ...
Original, with sun in the right place ...
The Manny cab is a superb piece of work. I am delighted that he invested time producing them. It must have been a nightmare for him reverse engineering these things. Even something as simple as routing the flipper button holes must have been difficult.
Manny has also applied the decals with tremendous care, as good as any I have seen - I have done this job myself and know how difficult it is.
I am sorry to contradict an earlier contributor, but imho my Manny cab is not better than when the original came out of the factory.
Right now I have a Manny cab fish tales sat alongside an original Williams fish tales cab. I am making the best I can out of two very nice Fish tales.
The Manny cab was made with tremendous care. It must have taken him ages to build it. It is streets ahead of a bashed up original.
The Williams cab has manufacturing imperfections. The Manny cab has manufacturing imperfections. They are both made of plywood so this is inevitable.
The Williams cabs have lasted decades, will the Manny cabs ? Only time will tell.
The repro fish tales decals are showing signs of bubbling on the bolt holes and where the caster is attached. The decals lack the texture of the originals, they feel too smooth.
Manny cab ..
The sun over the start button is in the wrong place. I need to put a USA style coin door on to hide white bits of decal as this is also badly designed.
Manny cab ...
The orange shading is not right and has an artificial line in it. Look at the horizontal line forming a triangle above the start button.
Manny ....
Faded original ...
I have had to reroute some braid wires as these interfered with the playfield slide mechanism. Not all bolts through the cab were braided. No biggie. Did not take me long.
The corners are just tighter and look better on the original. The original does not have prominent white edges either.
Manny ...
Original, with sun in the right place ...
The Manny cab is a superb piece of work. I am delighted that he invested time producing them. It must have been a nightmare for him reverse engineering these things. Even something as simple as routing the flipper button holes must have been difficult.
Manny has also applied the decals with tremendous care, as good as any I have seen - I have done this job myself and know how difficult it is.
I am sorry to contradict an earlier contributor, but imho my Manny cab is not better than when the original came out of the factory.
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OP
OP
I'm guessing this isn't typical of manny work but the decals do tend to wrinkle on so many restored games.
And how about the decals, wasn't there a debate on pinside a few years ago discussing screen print v inkjet. The latest inkjet could allegedly layer the artwork to get the texture of original, how did the latest generation of decals work out?
How about speaker upgrades and shakers, they're not original but I bet a good few that prefer full originals like em too.
i think most people would prefer mint original over a new but finding them is another thing
if you are doing a full restoration then you can get better than new and also add your own nice touches like i did on the T2 and HS2
but your more than likely not going to get your money back
if you yous good quality decals and fit a stern leg protector and cut back the decal round it then you wont get the wrinkling also use new legs most old legs are bent if you drag the pin on its legs then this kinks the legs at the top and tightens them to the cab thats why they wrinkle the cab
the bolt hole wrinkle is probably again not been cut back enough before being pushed through of over tightened
if you are doing a full restoration then you can get better than new and also add your own nice touches like i did on the T2 and HS2
but your more than likely not going to get your money back
if you yous good quality decals and fit a stern leg protector and cut back the decal round it then you wont get the wrinkling also use new legs most old legs are bent if you drag the pin on its legs then this kinks the legs at the top and tightens them to the cab thats why they wrinkle the cab
the bolt hole wrinkle is probably again not been cut back enough before being pushed through of over tightened
OP
OP
I drooled over that chrome t2
Manny did lots of cabs , and got better,
Depending unfortunately sometimes on who he was doing the work for and how busy his life was I presume .
He was but human.
I have seen his restoration on certain cabs first hand at his workshop and home, and his applying the decals for that particular cab went far and above anything I would do, he was applying thin coats of wet filler and repeatedly sanding.
I can only talk from my experience which is owning several manny cabs, also several Hiro done cabs, and my favourites done by Dave who used to be on the site, oh and also a few originals.
I much prefer the manny cabs I have to the faded originals.
Your not contradicting me DRD as you had that experience and your wants and needs are also going to be different.
I also have seen Manny cabs a little hurried, but i own and have seen some lovely ones as well. ( subjectively lovely to me but not going anywhere soon
)
Depending unfortunately sometimes on who he was doing the work for and how busy his life was I presume .
He was but human.
I have seen his restoration on certain cabs first hand at his workshop and home, and his applying the decals for that particular cab went far and above anything I would do, he was applying thin coats of wet filler and repeatedly sanding.
I can only talk from my experience which is owning several manny cabs, also several Hiro done cabs, and my favourites done by Dave who used to be on the site, oh and also a few originals.
I much prefer the manny cabs I have to the faded originals.
Your not contradicting me DRD as you had that experience and your wants and needs are also going to be different.
I also have seen Manny cabs a little hurried, but i own and have seen some lovely ones as well. ( subjectively lovely to me but not going anywhere soon
)
That’s my old fishy David.
The cab is an original Williams FT cab. I had him router the back box.
The decal was out of registration due to being poor reproductions. It was either have the sun dead center and have everything off or put it top dead center and have most other stuff line up. Manny was annoyed at this but had to work with what he had.
My original FT cab was bleached to near white so anything was better than that.
The cab is an original Williams FT cab. I had him router the back box.
The decal was out of registration due to being poor reproductions. It was either have the sun dead center and have everything off or put it top dead center and have most other stuff line up. Manny was annoyed at this but had to work with what he had.
My original FT cab was bleached to near white so anything was better than that.
Well cared for original.
I spent far too long doing a nice restoration, and just wanted an original at the end of it.
Last week I played an original 20yr old Who Dunnit that looked literally new - it was quite something.
I spent far too long doing a nice restoration, and just wanted an original at the end of it.
Last week I played an original 20yr old Who Dunnit that looked literally new - it was quite something.
Hope my decals from retro refurbs are better than this. Not keen on that orange shading ?
Those are not Pete B ones btw. Got em off eBay
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Regarding Fish Tales.
A Manny cabinet could never be as good as a nice original. Why? Because decals can never match a screen printed cabinet.
Screen printing is a much more expensive process and leads to a much better durable finish than stickers.
B/W stopped doing it due to expense. That is why CV and MB cabinets have all got wrinkles on them.
Stern stopped it due to cost cutting. Around Tron - some were screen printed, then they moved to decals which had higher resolution.
JJP did early run of WOZ with screen printed and clear coated. Again went to decals because of expense.
Spooky TNA - costs an extra $1000 for screen printed/butter cabinets.
So, that is why decals can't match screen printed as it is just a different, more expensive process.
That said, like Chris B says, decals on a well prepared cabinet, cut correctly with Stern leg protectors gives a real nice finish.
A Manny cabinet could never be as good as a nice original. Why? Because decals can never match a screen printed cabinet.
Screen printing is a much more expensive process and leads to a much better durable finish than stickers.
B/W stopped doing it due to expense. That is why CV and MB cabinets have all got wrinkles on them.
Stern stopped it due to cost cutting. Around Tron - some were screen printed, then they moved to decals which had higher resolution.
JJP did early run of WOZ with screen printed and clear coated. Again went to decals because of expense.
Spooky TNA - costs an extra $1000 for screen printed/butter cabinets.
So, that is why decals can't match screen printed as it is just a different, more expensive process.
That said, like Chris B says, decals on a well prepared cabinet, cut correctly with Stern leg protectors gives a real nice finish.
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- Jul 21, 2011
- Messages
- 2,808
Have seen a few in the USA that are like the day they came out of factory.
Probably because they go into basements so zero sunlight.
Not seen one in the UK though.
