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LED advice for LED noob - Terminator 2 (T2)

strongs

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Hi all,

Well it looks like I may have found myself a T2. It's not even on my doorstep yet and I'm planning to install an LED kit.

I've never undertaken any work on a pinball machine before - well apart from cleaning and waxing without stripping parts off the playfield.

I've seen a few photos on the internet of what other people have done with their T2's and have found that I like the look of alot of white led's. But when changing the bulbs how do I know which are the general illumination bulbs etc?

Can anyone recommend a T2 LED "kit"

ANY advice surrounding this subject will be most appreciated as I'm a little nervous about diving in. I also want to avoid spending alot of money on LED's and not getting the "right look"

Thanks in advance.
 
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I'm not much into mods but if I still had mine I would definitely be adding this.

image.jpeg
 
Here's mine, granted the previous owner did this but I think it works well so I won't be changing it, under playfield are standard LEDs and above for the GI are superbrights.


So I would say for under the playfield one of these kits will do you fine: http://www.pinball-led.co.uk/shop/4587697740/superbright-smd-playfield-insert-kits-(o---z)/9179746
(the benefit is if you are a bit new at this it comes with the right LED's and instructions where to put them, there are other kits available with better LED's but more pricey).
For GI I would highly recommend these: http://www.pinball-led.co.uk/shop/4587697740/premium-2-x-smd-led-non-ghosting-44-bayonet/9179766
The only thing with GI is you are a bit snookered as there are no 'kits' and you will have to figure out on your own what you need to order.
Backbox is a mixture of red behind the letters and white everywhere else. These are 555 lamps rather than 44's.

I avoided the rail light mod, honestly I think its overkill and it is very easy to over-mod a T2. There are certain ones that are a must such as the hunter-killer, chrome cannon etc but sometimes it is too much.
 
Quick question. I thought these kits came complete i.e. a replacement for every bulb. Can someone explain the GI and under playfield in more detail as I'm not sure I understand the differences. I thought general illumination could also be under the playfield?

Sorry guys noob here.
 
If I am not mistaken the video I posted above. Would I be correct in saying that the GI is all White LED's?
 
Sorry for all the posts but I keep thinking of questions. The flasher strobe LED's where are these used? do they have to be used? or can you just use regular LED's?
 
Quick question. I thought these kits came complete i.e. a replacement for every bulb. Can someone explain the GI and under playfield in more detail as I'm not sure I understand the differences. I thought general illumination could also be under the playfield?

Sorry guys noob here.

GI is generally what is on top and round the edge, the bulbs that stick through the playfield to illuminte plastics and stuff. To my knowledge NOBODY sells kits for these in the UK, you can get GI kits from Comet/Pinballife in the US but this would be way more expensive than just working out what lamps you need to cover GI, also you have the added bonus of deciding what colours you want to use. The playfield kits that are sold by @alchy only cover the lamps underneath, so all the stuff that is lighting the insert lights.

Sorry for all the posts but I keep thinking of questions. The flasher strobe LED's where are these used? do they have to be used? or can you just use regular LED's?

These are used in place of flasher lamps (i.e. ones that 'pulse' on and off at certain points during the game). on T2 you will find some in the backbox and some on the inlanes near the slings, there is also one under the cannon I believe. You CANNOT use regular LED's, they either flat out won't work or just lock on and burn up.
 
These are used in place of flasher lamps (i.e. ones that 'pulse' on and off at certain points during the game). on T2 you will find some in the backbox and some on the inlanes near the slings, there is also one under the cannon I believe. You CANNOT use regular LED's, they either flat out won't work or just lock on and burn up.

So do the strobes "led flashers" come in the kits? I assume they would as a majority go under the playfield?
 
So do the strobes "led flashers" come in the kits? I assume they would as a majority go under the playfield?

I've never known flashers to be included, they generally have to be bought separately. Worth asking though before you buy the kit.
 
Can someone explain the GI and under playfield in more detail as I'm not sure I understand the differences. I thought general illumination could also be under the playfield?

Hi, strongs,

Another term for 'general illumination' might be 'background illumination', such as under decorated lightshields, ramps, etc, often (but by no means always) in Jet or Thumper bumpers, most non-flashbulbs behind the backglass/translite on modern games, and coin entries. There are always exceptions, though. In the case of Terminator 2, the four lamps for the 'Get the Cpu' inserts in the centre of the playfield are a gen. illumination circuit or 'string' all by themselves.

General illumination circuits use ac power, and all the lamps connected on each circuit are dimmed or shut off (if at all) in unison.

The lamps termed 'insert' or 'feature' lamps are individually controlled by the Cpu following the games' program, though sometimes two or more lamps are connected in parallel, either under the same lens/insert or separately, such as some games' outlane 'Special' lamps.

'Flashbulbs', named partly after the first game using them (or was it the other way round?), briefly shine brightly, mostly for effect, using at least 20v to ensure that the lamp(s) used, which are really meant for a lower voltage*, are BRIGHT. The drive circuit for each f/bulb circuit is similar to that for a solenoid drive.

* I'm almost sure that a #89 bulb is equivalent to a 12v, 5W tail-light bulb
 
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Sorry @strongs_uk, I've been buried up to my eyes with work for the last week or so and consequently pinball has had to take a back seat. :(

All of the below is my opinion and won't be the same view held by everyone, you can do whatever makes you happy with your own machine!

Theres only one type of lamp worth using for playfield GI and thats the Comet Opmax, nothing else comes close. http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/opmax.htm
I've used natural white in T2 because its a sci fi theme and has cold coloured artwork, (greys and blues.) Most playfields look better with sunlight though as its a little less harsh. I NEVER use coloured lamps for GI unless it was supposed to come that way from the factory (half the GI in Black Rose is red for example.) I know a lot of people clearly have a very different view to me because I see loads of coloured GI at every show. Sorry guys but it looks ****e to my eyes! The whole point of GI is to illuminate the machine so you can see the ball and the artwork as the artist intended. Colouring your GI makes the artwork look pants and the ball harder to see. All of my tables are just as easy to play in a pitch black room as they are in daylight. If you can't see the ball easily when playing in a pitch black room then you're completely missing the point of GI! (The clues in the name lol)

For the translight I use the frosted versions of these: http://www.cometpinball.com/Comet-Pinball-2-LEDs-p/2led.htm
They're cheap and provide even illumination so that the artwork doesn't look spotty like most cheap LEDs do. Spotty translights look pants. Same story regarding colour here, just don't do it unless you want your machine to look cheap and tacky. Not even red ones behind the eyes as you can't get the red light exactly where you want it, it just spills out all over the place.

For the inserts I used a premium 2 kit from Pinball LED (@alchy) but replaced the blue LEDs in the kit with natural white.....because you guessed it coloured lamps where they don't belong look pants. The only exception to this rule that springs to mind is the "worm hole" insert on STTNG, purple looks pretty cool there. (My ones currently white but I'm going to change it to make it pop a bit more.) T2 is the only table I have where I've used premium 2's and they're pretty good. I don't think they work any better than a bare SMD for insert illumination though and the large faceted lens makes them difficult to fit in some places so I probably wouldn't buy them again.

Generally speaking I'm not a huge fan of mods, but subtle ones are nice. T2 is by far my most modded machine and compared to some it may as well be standard, sometimes less is more! Anyway the mods I have installed:

Brite Eyes in the skull: http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=3256
Illuminated eye plastic over the left ramp, T1000 on the center targets, illuminated saucers and illuminated HK ship from Dreads
.

I did modify the HK ship mod though by replacing the blue LEDs with white because I felt the blue looked out of place. I also tied the 5 LEDs to the target lights below rather than it just continously "scanning" as long as the machine was switched on. Its a far better effect IMO and isn't distracting when you're trying to play the game. Does anybody really want to have bright blue flashing LEDs in their face when the whole table goes dark when you're playing a video mode?

The HK mod has the added benefit of providing great protection to the thin plastic from airballs.

I've also installed a Pinsound board too and Flipper Fidelity speakers. I love T2 but its a basic game so its nice to have the option to switch between the original sounds, reorchesterated and OST from the movie at will.


I'll also be fitting PDI glass when the next batch finally arrives! :rolleyes:

Anyway I've tried to take a few pics of my T2 to give you an idea of how it looks but its not easy to accurately capture what the naked eye can see. The spread of light is far more even in reality.

Hope this helps and doesn't cause offence to anyone because none was intended, its just my opinion.....
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Yup I played that T2 and it was amazing, and looked even better!!!

pinball heaven ,if I recall, does a full kit of LEDS (for beginners!!) that includes every single lamp - GI, flasher, inserts and even backbox - @philpalmer please correct me if I'm wrong

Cheers Kev
 
I've come to the conclusion that any digital photo demonstrating the even spread of LED lighting is futile, as the pics always come out looking nothing like the actual thing. In these pics the lighting looks terrible!

Nice job Aaron, really appreciate the details in your write up. Maybe one day I'll be forced to go the LED route as all incandescent bulbs will be illegal and/or unavailable..... could be a way off still though, so I've stockpiled plenty of 47s, 555s and 89s
 
Sorry @strongs_uk, I've been buried up to my eyes with work for the last week or so and consequently pinball has had to take a back seat. :(

All of the below is my opinion and won't be the same view held by everyone, you can do whatever makes you happy with your own machine!

Theres only one type of lamp worth using for playfield GI and thats the Comet Opmax, nothing else comes close. http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/opmax.htm
I've used natural white in T2 because its a sci fi theme and has cold coloured artwork, (greys and blues.) Most playfields look better with sunlight though as its a little less harsh. I NEVER use coloured lamps for GI unless it was supposed to come that way from the factory (half the GI in Black Rose is red for example.) I know a lot of people clearly have a very different view to me because I see loads of coloured GI at every show. Sorry guys but it looks ****e to my eyes! The whole point of GI is to illuminate the machine so you can see the ball and the artwork as the artist intended. Colouring your GI makes the artwork look pants and the ball harder to see. All of my tables are just as easy to play in a pitch black room as they are in daylight. If you can't see the ball easily when playing in a pitch black room then you're completely missing the point of GI! (The clues in the name lol)

For the translight I use the frosted versions of these: http://www.cometpinball.com/Comet-Pinball-2-LEDs-p/2led.htm
They're cheap and provide even illumination so that the artwork doesn't look spotty like most cheap LEDs do. Spotty translights look pants. Same story regarding colour here, just don't do it unless you want your machine to look cheap and tacky. Not even red ones behind the eyes as you can't get the red light exactly where you want it, it just spills out all over the place.

For the inserts I used a premium 2 kit from Pinball LED (@alchy) but replaced the blue LEDs in the kit with natural white.....because you guessed it coloured lamps where they don't belong look pants. The only exception to this rule that springs to mind is the "worm hole" insert on STTNG, purple looks pretty cool there. (My ones currently white but I'm going to change it to make it pop a bit more.) T2 is the only table I have where I've used premium 2's and they're pretty good. I don't think they work any better than a bare SMD for insert illumination though and the large faceted lens makes them difficult to fit in some places so I probably wouldn't buy them again.

Generally speaking I'm not a huge fan of mods, but subtle ones are nice. T2 is by far my most modded machine and compared to some it may as well be standard, sometimes less is more! Anyway the mods I have installed:

Brite Eyes in the skull: http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=3256
Illuminated eye plastic over the left ramp, T1000 on the center targets, illuminated saucers and illuminated HK ship from Dreads
.

I did modify the HK ship mod though by replacing the blue LEDs with white because I felt the blue looked out of place. I also tied the 5 LEDs to the target lights below rather than it just continously "scanning" as long as the machine was switched on. Its a far better effect IMO and isn't distracting when you're trying to play the game. Does anybody really want to have bright blue flashing LEDs in their face when the whole table goes dark when you're playing a video mode?

The HK mod has the added benefit of providing great protection to the thin plastic from airballs.

I've also installed a Pinsound board too and Flipper Fidelity speakers. I love T2 but its a basic game so its nice to have the option to switch between the original sounds, reorchesterated and OST from the movie at will.


I'll also be fitting PDI glass when the next batch finally arrives! :rolleyes:

Anyway I've tried to take a few pics of my T2 to give you an idea of how it looks but its not easy to accurately capture what the naked eye can see. The spread of light is far more even in reality.

Hope this helps and doesn't cause offence to anyone because none was intended, its just my opinion.....
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Looks sweet as Aaron - what do you do with flashers - coloured or white, and if so which do you use ?

Cheers Kev
 
Hi @aaronhicksuk thanks for all the advice on LED's and for the pictures of your table it looks absolutely stunning! I found your write up very informative and I'm sure it will help me in the future as well as others.

Things have however taken a slight turn....as you know from my first post I had managed to source a T2 that I was planning to LED, well...

I had almost closed the deal when I noticed another T2 on eBay. It was in the background of an image for another auction, I thought "It can't hurt to ask" so I contacted the seller and he said he was planning to sell it but hadn't got around to listing it.

I said I was interested and asked for some photos and more info. Later that day I received the photos and the information that the machine had already been LED'd and the machine also came with some other nice things such as...

T-1000 Figure Mod sat above targets (bullet holes light up)​

T-1000 Chrome Ball Shooter Lane cover

New Hunter Ship

New T2 Skull

New Plastic Ramp and lot's of other new plastics including all new clear star posts.

Red leg protectors

Red led eyes behind ramp plastics

New rubbers throughout.​

This all sounded great! and only a few hundred quid more than the original deal!! I was sold (albeit I was slightly over budget)

I collected yesterday!

...after everything you said above regarding GI I think you're going to dislike my tables lighting but I have to say I'm chuffed with it, especially how the blue LED's at the back of the table light up what is normally a pretty dark area and also creates a UV effect on the reds.

Thanks again.

A few photos for ya'll...

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2362_zpsdidnydna.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2354_zps7xnv6w8l.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2351_zpsgglhvvde.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2350_zps2hhfbfas.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2346_zpsni9gtby4.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2345_zpsqjqxys9z.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2344_zps07h8fihh.jpg

i23.photobucket.com_albums_b372_acidburn7683_Terminator_202_20Pinball_IMG_2343_zpsoqsdj3nb.jpg
 
@strongs_uk Looks really nice man, Id just enjoy it and play it. Doesn't look like it needs very much at all in terms of mods, seems to have all the major stuff already!
 
Well done @strongs_uk, that looks like a really nice T2 :)

@kevlar - I've tried using all sorts of flashers on my machines. I try to colour match if they are behind an insert or dome etc. I've found the really tall "corn cob" or "tree" style lamps don't fit under most domes, but you can get shorter ones from some places including Comet that fit well. The most important thing I've found is to make sure the light is sent out in the right directions. Underneath plastics and behind the translite I just use whites.

Here's a few that I've tried from Comet that I quite like:

http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/10smd5630t10.htm - Work well under domes
http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/8smdflexflash.htm - These work well under playfield inserts (e.g. return to duty on STTNG)
http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/8smdflash.htm - Good for backboxes

Not a flasher but these work great in pops: http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/6smdfan.htm
 
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