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Unofficial UK tournament thread?

VeeMonroe

VeeMonroe

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There's been some great posts about tournament play recently, such as @Taxiturn's brilliant Diary of a Beginning Tournament Player.

However, I've noticed things can get lost/buried because there doesn't seem to be a central place on the forum to talk about all things tournament - whether it be YouTube tip videos, upcoming tournaments, moans about WPPRs, and so on.

Anyway, I thought maybe I could open something similar to my 'moans about pricing thread', which started in 2022 and is still going - two years later - and on its 29th page!
 
I've been following Tim Sexton's (Stern programmer) tip videos on YouTube, and especially enjoyed his nudging/tilting video, which I found super-helpful as someone who isn't very tall or heavy (Tim says he's 5ft 6").

Tim posted a day or so ago explaining why he was pulling out the US tournament scene, including 'Pinball Farming' and the $1 fee for entry changing the nature of the competition scene. I didn't 100% understand the issues, as it is US focused, but wondered what people thought.

 
I've been watching a fair amount of Pinball Shenanigans and always found it odd how he seems to be playing in 3ish tournaments at the same time. Still very new on the scene but have been enjoying the uk tournaments ive been to so far. It feels to me like the size of the venues in America with their larger quantities of pins could be what facilitates that approach.

I also don't think id want divisions in tournaments for different quality players, playing in a tournament with some of the best players in the country like Greg, Josh, Pete etc can be very daunting and demotivating initially knowing you're not going to win but personally I've found everyone including them to be very welcoming and offering advice on what to aim for. Plus watching them play has taught me so much which I wouldn't get with divisions. oh and if I do even come close to taking a game from them I ride that high for a week :P
 
KendarTheOrc said:
I've been watching a fair amount of Pinball Shenanigans and always found it odd how he seems to be playing in 3ish tournaments at the same time. Still very new on the scene but have been enjoying the uk tournaments ive been to so far. It feels to me like the size of the venues in America with their larger quantities of pins could be what facilitates that approach.

I also don't think id want divisions in tournaments for different quality players, playing in a tournament with some of the best players in the country like Greg, Josh, Pete etc can be very daunting and demotivating initially knowing you're not going to win but personally I've found everyone including them to be very welcoming and offering advice on what to aim for. Plus watching them play has taught me so much which I wouldn't get with divisions. oh and if I do even come close to taking a game from them I ride that high for a week :p
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I sympathised with the beginning of his video because there have been a couple of tournaments where we've had to leave before the end because our childcare 'ran out', or where I've had to disappear midway through to get lunch or simply some fresh air!

However, I didn't fully understand why he felt matchplay made a tournament scene less competitive. It felt like (to be uncharitable) his model of a tournament is to keep submitting scores to grind your 1,320,322 to 1,320,350, and that reducing this numerical complexity to 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th place lost something somehow.

Personally, I enjoy matchplay. Not only because, as he says, it's beginner friendly because better players give tips and there can be upsets but, also, because you're focused on beating other players rather than score maximisation/grinding. If everyone in your four-player game is struggling on a really tough Fish Tales, for example, you can go for video mode for the win!! If it's a 'best-card' tournament, the temptation is to grind monster fish/caster's club because those are the only high-scoring options for that machine.

To be honest, I think people naturally create their own divisions. I think everyone playing regularly (in the UK) knows who plays similar standard to them (and, if they don't, IPFA has stats) and you can benchmark yourself against how those players are doing - you don't need to be pre-sorted into groups :)
 
VeeMonroe said:
Tim posted a day or so ago explaining why he was pulling out the US tournament scene, including 'Pinball Farming' and the $1 fee for entry changing the nature of the competition scene. I didn't 100% understand the issues, as it is US focused, but wondered what people thought.
Click to expand...

"In summer 2023, I made the decision to retire from all competitive pinball tournaments"
1717676484912.png

Obviously didnt last long.... :D
 
VeeMonroe said:
I've been following Tim Sexton's (Stern programmer) tip videos on YouTube, and especially enjoyed his nudging/tilting video, which I found super-helpful as someone who isn't very tall or heavy (Tim says he's 5ft 6").

Tim posted a day or so ago explaining why he was pulling out the US tournament scene, including 'Pinball Farming' and the $1 fee for entry changing the nature of the competition scene. I didn't 100% understand the issues, as it is US focused, but wondered what people thought.

Click to expand...
Regardless of the content, whatever that style of video editing is, I hate it - slow zoom, reset, slow zoom, reset. Every bleeding sentence 😖.
 
Marvello said:
Regardless of the content, whatever that style of video editing is, I hate it - slow zoom, reset, slow zoom, reset. Every bleeding sentence 😖.
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I've just gone and back to rewatch the beginning with the sound off...

Yes, it sort-of zooms in close to his eyes to emphasise each point, and then lurches back out like the camera person was stood on a wildly-rocking rowing boat!

Anyway, I didn't notice on first watch, so anyone who is interested can watch without fear of motion sickness :)
 
I thing that the biggest problem for competitive pinball is simply the lack of players.

If we had lot of players, then it would be easy to organise into skill based leagues or ladders, like with many other competitive sports.
 
AlanJ said:
I thing that the biggest problem for competitive pinball is simply the lack of players.

If we had lot of players, then it would be easy to organise into skill based leagues or ladders, like with many other competitive sports.
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In some ways it would be nice if there were beginner leagues / events where I would have some chance of making finals or winning. But, I think playing with and watching much better players will make me a better player quicker.

Divisions or lower tier events could also lead to more admin and controversy; what if somebody sandbags so they can enter and win, what about the people playing their first tournament but who have been playing at home or in arcades for decades etc etc which just isn’t an issue when we’re all in the same comps.

I do like the idea of a ladder though!
 
For me I started playing in league at Tilt in June this year and for the first few weeks I just went around playing on my own. I felt each week I was gaining experience and getting better scores. Now I enjoy playing with better players (don't like getting battered) but they have shown me different ways to play the machines and this piece of knowledge is priceless. I agree with @Taxiturn that it would be nice to have ranked leagues but like others have said there are not enough players.
 
Back with the tournament thread, my original plan was to post useful resources or videos.

I'm sure everyone has been recommended the Abe Flips 'How To' videos on basic pinball skills until they're blue in the face, but - incase not - here they are :)

Aiming and Shooting:
Drop Catch:
Live Catch:
Shielding:
Micro-flips:
Post Pass:
Dead Bounce:
Skip Pass:
Slap Save:
Nudging Part 1:
Nudging Part 2:
 
If you are a woman or child, or just a small man, then - in my experience - most nudging/slap saving techniques probably won't work for you.

However, Stern code developer Tim Sexton (who is apparently my height) has a great video on nudging/save stances (as a smaller/weaker person):


I saw Helen de Haan -Verbeek doing some amazingly athletic nudges during the Ladies Final of the UK Open 2024 - mostly following what Tim is doing here, but with extra vim and vigour! At one point, she saved a ball by kneeing the machine in its metaphorical groin and then full body wrestled it towards the ground. The pin didn't move that much, but the manoeuvre did the job while looking impressive!
 
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Tips-wise, PAPA Pinball have a whole (and still growing) set of game tutorial videos, mostly presented by Bowen Kerins, the 10th best IFPA ranked player in the world:


If you're starting out (or just not that great), they can be above your level of play and just make you feel intimidated. Bowen Kerins makes most of his shots with 99% accuracy and doesn't account for the varied skills between players.

You can find written rules and strategies for individual pins on PinTips, the Tilt Forums Wiki (mostly new machines) and on Silverball Mania (older pins).
 
Apologies, folks, I'm going to move everything over to a new thread. This one, I realise, it a bit confusing now for purpose due to the video discussion near the beginning.
 
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