Water White top VUK

[Truggy]

Not the gold mine, the top VUK. The multi-ball lock.

I've rebuild the entire mechanism (AGAIN), and disabled the multi-ball.

Why disable? It will kick out one ball fine. Perfect actually - first time. But... if there's multiple balls in the lock, 2 balls will end up in the cup, and the thing will just fire off until it over heats. Then I'm replacing coils/sleeves/armatures again.

Is there suppose to be a flap? Or something to stop more than one ball entering the VUK? I've looked thro the official docs, and I can't see anything missing.

Is one solution an over-powered coil?

 

[PBrookfield]

Two balls getting stuck in the VUK rail is a symptom rather than the problem. The balls wait in line to the VUK normally and a second ball can only enter once one has already been fired. So a rollback has already happened for there to be a Newton's cradle happening.

Thankfully we know you've already rebuilt the VUK and that it seems to kick out OK at first, and I've seen the fault in action for years, so the items to try...

1. Check VUK guide rail is aligned properly.
2. Run your fingers along the insides of the guide rail and check for rough spots, dents, lots of dirt, anything that will contribute excess friction.
3. Check the levelling of the machine is 100% right.
4. It's a bitch to check because of where the VUK is but you may want to look at how the balls all lie in the trough, and the VUK, when there are two or three balls in line to shoot. Maybe you need to adjust the positioning of the VUK somewhat so that the cup sits higher, so that 'queued up' balls don't impede on the loaded ball pre-launch so much.
5. If all of the above physical issues are okay, the coil may just be losing too much power as the game heats up - in which case you're going to want to look in the backbox instead and start considering the bridges, or the power driver board. Unless you know the bridges are fairly new these are candidates for power loss, though usually the first components to complain about this on WPC games is the mainboard, with the infamous 'resets on flipping' issue.

My personal bet though is that you may need to bend some metal to improve the physical arrangement of that guide rail, or the VUK. I really don't think it's the coil power because even over a year ago, I managed to unstick the game by tactical, music-gaming-honed timing to tilt the machine in a way that the VUK had a clean shot without a second ball impeding.

 

[Sgt GrizZ]

Hi Truggy - welcome to the forum.

Couple things - which I'm sure you will have checked/considered

Is it the correct strength coil fitted ?

Is the cup in perfect condition - no missing prongs, damage etc ?

I don't recall there being a flap.

 

[PBrookfield]

Hi Truggy - welcome to the forum.

Couple things - which I'm sure you will have checked/considered

Is it the correct strength coil fitted ?

Is the cup in perfect condition - no missing prongs, damage etc ?

I don't recall there being a flap.

It's definitely the right coil - when it's working properly it's firing at the proper speed/strength. It's 100% a physical blockage

 

[Sgt GrizZ]

It's definitely the right coil - when it's working properly it's firing at the proper speed/strength. It's 100% a physical blockage

Cool

I agree then. Sounds like a mechanical issue. Wireform and cup are my suspects. It is a major pain to get at that mech in a way to see what is happening clearly.

 

[Truggy]

Is it not more a physical UNblockage?

The cup is brand new - we got a pile of new ones last week. I think the coil is the 23-800 in the photo. It's been replaced a lot, because of overheating and expansion.

Some great suggestions there ppl, I'll be trying all of them.

 

[Truggy]

I love this machine, and I want it running perfect. Last time it ran perfect (after total rebuild) I beat the previous high score, and got 808 million!

It needs to be running perfect again so you people can come and try to beat that score

 

[PBrookfield]

Is it not more a physical UNblockage?

The cup is brand new - we got a pile of new ones last week. I think the coil is the 23-800 in the photo. It's been replaced a lot, because of overheating and expansion.

Some great suggestions there ppl, I'll be trying all of them.

The fix would be an unblockage maybe but the problem cause is definitely the ball not having a clear path of flight through the guide rail - either friction or it 'hits' the wireform too much on launch, or one of the queued up balls is overhanging the VUK's playfield hole too much and the combined pressure of the ball on the cup, and the ball having to be pushed out of the way is too much for the coil to make the shot in the first place. And by that point, once the second ball loads into the cup and the first ball comes back, it's too late.

That being said... I reckon that the VUK should actually be able to throw a ball hard enough to clear out two balls stacked but I have no proof of that. It would depend if the second ball lands cleanly 'stacked' enough or not... and of course how much of the original problem is down to guide rail alignment / friction / dirt etc.

 

[PBrookfield]

808 million ain't at all bad!

 

[Truggy]

The previous was 751. So I kinda gave up after I'd beat that.

I'll admit... I did have to take the glass off for a minute during that run. Because..... all 3 balls where stuck in the top VUK cup

 

[Sgt GrizZ]

It should cope with clearing 2 balls. Have it happen from time to time on mine - first ball for whatever reason doesn't clear the wireform. Would surely have been considered in design and testing ..that it can cope , otherwise it would only be a matter of time before the game was out of commission.

 

[Truggy]

According to the handbook it should be a 23-800 coil. The last one I fit - last week with new armature, new cup, and new sleeve - was a second-hand coil. We're just ordering a batch of new coils now.

I have seen it clear two ball at once in the past. Maybe when it was in the other room. Where it is positioned ATM you can move the cabinet around a lot. Slippy floor!

 

[Truggy]

The fix would be an unblockage maybe but the problem cause is definitely the ball not having a clear path of flight through the guide rail - either friction or it 'hits' the wireform too much on launch, or one of the queued up balls is overhanging the VUK's playfield hole too much and the combined pressure of the ball on the cup, and the ball having to be pushed out of the way is too much for the coil to make the shot in the first place. And by that point, once the second ball loads into the cup and the first ball comes back, it's too late.

That being said... I reckon that the VUK should actually be able to throw a ball hard enough to clear out two balls stacked but I have no proof of that. It would depend if the second ball lands cleanly 'stacked' enough or not... and of course how much of the original problem is down to guide rail alignment / friction / dirt etc.

Something I've just remembered which supports your theory... the rubber bottom grommet was missing for a long time!

 

[CHRIS B PINBALLS]

Plunger is in probably the wrong one and too long I bet it’s been mixed up with the lost mine one as that is longer than the lock one

 

[Truggy]

Plunger is in probably the wrong one and too long I bet it’s been mixed up with the lost mine one as that is longer than the lock one

Interesting! It's a brand new plunger. I have the part number in the work shop so I can check if it's the correct part. Thanks

 

[Truggy]

So.... here's the official doc, and what I have fit