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eBay, Etsy, Vinted and all the popular Marketplace platforms now have to inform the HMRC.

Colywobbles

Colywobbles

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In an effort to curb Side Hustles this year the HMRC are now supplied with each sellers total sales over each finantial year.
This is to stop non declared earnings and black market traders.

So what does this mean for people who sell there pins on eBay?
Well apparently you can trade on any Marketplace as long as it’s below £1000 in any financial year in total and HMRC won’t be informed if you sell less than 30 items in that same period.

I myself put quite a bit on eBay for a non techie mate who trades action figures from NECA etc. This is usually well over both limits and I even take the payments and give him cash so that will now come to an end for sure.

It will be interesting to see how many pins now come up for sale albeit not everyone will be aware of the new rules straight away.
 
www.gov.uk

Capital Gains Tax on personal possessions

What personal possessions (chattels) you need to pay Capital Gains Tax (CGT) on, how to work out your gain
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

This new requirement could also be used for finding those that don't pay capital gains tax when selling a "personal possession" for over £6k. It could catch out a lot of the higher end titles and create a whole load of paperwork for a small amount or nil tax revenue.
 
Last time i checked you don't "offer up" your NI number when creating an account on these sites. It's all FUD (imho) as they know a certain percentage will tip up and i'm sure it falls foul of GDPR.

community.ebay.co.uk

The Taxman is coming

Daily Mail article 18th October. From 1st Jan 2024 all on-line sales platforms will have to notify HMRC of sales data for sellers. Can Ebay please confirm what data they will be providing.
community.ebay.co.uk community.ebay.co.uk
 
So if you sell 29 pins you are still ok or does that £1000 rule take precedent?

Given how short staffed the tax office appear to be it’s hard to see how vigilant they will be.
 
Reading the capital gains thing you dont have to pay it on items with a limited lifespan, i.e. of less than 50 years including all machinery.

Pretty sure pins of the past were only designed to last a few years before being binned so I think we are safe for now.

Also it only applies to items over £6k and if you will make a profit from it, so all those TAFs and TZs bought years ago for £600 you now have to sell for £5,999 and less. ;)
 
Arv said:
Last time i checked you don't "offer up" your NI number when creating an account on these sites. It's all FUD (imho) as they know a certain percentage will tip up and i'm sure it falls foul of GDPR.

community.ebay.co.uk

The Taxman is coming

Daily Mail article 18th October. From 1st Jan 2024 all on-line sales platforms will have to notify HMRC of sales data for sellers. Can Ebay please confirm what data they will be providing.
community.ebay.co.uk community.ebay.co.uk
Click to expand...
The sites will be required by the HMRC to collect your NI number as a condition of being able to trade in the UK, as I understand it. If you are selling stuff you previously bought at a loss then tax doesn't apply, which should cover 99% of pin sales these days 🤣🤣🤣
 
I agree with @Fantazia2 that pinball machines should be considered machinery and thus exempt from CGT.

The main issue for those moving high volumes of machines is whether their activities are tantamount to a trade, that being the buying and selling of pins with a view to a profit. The tests HMRC will apply are the “badges of trade” which are considered in the round and include profit motive and trading frequency. If you are considered trading then this would bring your net profits from these activities within the scope of income tax. The eBay data may direct HMRC to raise enquiries as to the nature of the sales and justification for why do not consider yourself to be trading (if you have not declared anything).

If you are selling a couple of pins a year I don’t think this will cause any issues at all, but if you are shifting high volume and are not already declaring your profits then I would recommend that you seek advice from an accountant or tax advisor. This could also have knock-on implications for other taxes like VAT.
 
johnwhitfield said:
So if you sell 29 pins you are still ok or does that £1000 rule take precedent?

Given how short staffed the tax office appear to be it’s hard to see how vigilant they will be.
Click to expand...
Well i read before it's a team of 30 odd people.
 
johnwhitfield said:
So if you sell 29 pins you are still ok or does that £1000 rule take precedent?

Given how short staffed the tax office appear to be it’s hard to see how vigilant they will be.
Click to expand...

[Removed part of post as clearly machinery exemption applies]

If you are effectively running a self employed "side hustle" business on ebay then you should be filling out an HMRC self assessment and paying the appropriate tax if your turnover is over £1K. There is a specific question about it on the self assessment form.

1704200501228.png

The HMRC rules haven't changed here - people should always have been self declaring their full earnings to HMRC and filling out self assessment if they have multiple employments are self employed or high earners. I expect most running small side hustles on ebay are unaware of their potential tax liability (or are aware and choose not to declare it). HMRC have just got the online market places to send them the information they need to work out whom they should pursue for undeclared income and unpaid taxes.
 
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Taxiturn said:
I agree with @Fantazia2 that pinball machines should be considered machinery and thus exempt from CGT.

The main issue for those moving high volumes of machines is whether their activities are tantamount to a trade, that being the buying and selling of pins with a view to a profit. The tests HMRC will apply are the “badges of trade” which are considered in the round and include profit motive and trading frequency. If you are considered trading then this would bring your net profits from these activities within the scope of income tax. The eBay data may direct HMRC to raise enquiries as to the nature of the sales and justification for why do not consider yourself to be trading (if you have not declared anything).

If you are selling a couple of pins a year I don’t think this will cause any issues at all, but if you are shifting high volume and are not already declaring your profits then I would recommend that you seek advice from an accountant or tax advisor. This could also have knock-on implications for other taxes like VAT.
Click to expand...
Are you a taxman? Tax adviser? :)
 
It’s my understanding that Information is sent digitally to HMRC for sales of over 1000, you’ll then automatically be asked to submit a self assessment tax return, if you don’t you’ll be deemed to be in profit and hit with penalties ( remember HMRC are above the law and don’t have to prove anything) * So now you’ll have to do a return to prove profit and loss- this will be where the 30 strong team will be involved to investigate.
* There was a case of a single tv industry bloke(maybe a camera man) who bought a 5/6 bedroom house , several years later HMRC deemed he’d been renting out rooms and hit him with a massive fine/penalty, took it to court and had his house possessed and sold. He fought it all the way asking where their proof was- they didn’t have any, but still prevailed.
 
Jagspete said:
It’s my understanding that Information is sent digitally to HMRC for sales of over 1000, you’ll then automatically be asked to submit a self assessment tax return, if you don’t you’ll be deemed to be in profit and hit with penalties ( remember HMRC are above the law and don’t have to prove anything) * So now you’ll have to do a return to prove profit and loss- this will be where the 30 strong team will be involved to investigate.
* There was a case of a single tv industry bloke(maybe a camera man) who bought a 5/6 bedroom house , several years later HMRC deemed he’d been renting out rooms and hit him with a massive fine/penalty, took it to court and had his house possessed and sold. He fought it all the way asking where their proof was- they didn’t have any, but still prevailed.
Click to expand...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connect_(computer_system) allegedly (most probably just like the TV Detector vans they never had)

This is all going to change anyways when the Bank of England introduces the Digital Pound. You'll have no side hustles then.
 
HMRC have been monitoring eBay for at least a couple of years although I’m not sure what extent they have been ‘supplying information’ to each other. I know of one member on here that was getting letters from the revenue after selling on eBay. I’ll tag him but it’s up to him if he wants to reveal what went down @Carl85
For clarification it wasn’t for pin sales but more selling off his childhood video game collection
 
This is also effecting Crypto Currency trading, had emails from a couple of crypto sites recently about changes to their services as they have to inform HMRC now of UK activity, and also some I used in the past now block access from the UK, assuming due to these new reporting rules that they cant be bothered compying with, a bit like when the import VAT changes were made so the sellers had to collect for any purchase under £130 and register to pay to HMRC, which made a few of the smaller ones stop selling direct to the UK.
 
Arv said:
This is all going to change anyways when the Bank of England introduces the Digital Pound. You'll have no side hustles then.
Click to expand...
When that happens we'll be bartering chickens, eggs, other various livestock and used pinball parts. Digital enforced currency or not, there will always be a work around.
 
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Who knows - seriously ?

The HMRC put a thing out a few years ago about them having a department that checks on bands/venues by looking on facebook etc..... As I am self employed and music is part of my living - I do declare my earnings as the gear I buy goes against tax etc..... On paper I make very little really. I do not know one person in one semi-professional band that has ever had its earnings investigated.

eBay do not have NI number and never will.

I do not sell much on ebay now. Also I am sure it is easier for them to go to for the people who registered as 'business sellers'.

This is my opinion:

You work hard (and pay income tax) for your money to spend on stuff you want.
You pay VAT on that item if bought new or used from a shop etc.
Most items you sell (personally) on ebay is not for gain. You make a loss.
So do HMRC see this as 100% profit and tell you to pay tax?
Or do you have to save a receipt for say a laptop that is 5 years old you paid £600 new and sold for £100.....
 
I wonder then if you (say) sold the odd 3d print on flea bay [just for example] you would be able to claim the money back you spend over the year on a printer and consumables.
Dont imagine there are fortunes to be made but selling 30 3d prints probably isnt many ? (I say that - I tried putting 2 on there and didnt get a bid on either.. but ebay is ebay after all)

Does seem like its just another reason for people to give up on flea bay though
 
HomerRamone said:
I wonder then if you (say) sold the odd 3d print on flea bay [just for example] you would be able to claim the money back you spend over the year on a printer and consumables.
Dont imagine there are fortunes to be made but selling 30 3d prints probably isnt many ? (I say that - I tried putting 2 on there and didnt get a bid on either.. but ebay is ebay after all)

Does seem like its just another reason for people to give up on flea bay though
Click to expand...
If you only sold the “odd print” then HMRC would strongly argue that you are not trading and so any losses / capital allowances claimed would not actually be allowable.

I think the key thing that is getting missed in all of this commentary on social media is that this is only going to be a problem for TRADERS who sell on these platforms and are not currently declaring some or all of their profits. The tax rules haven’t changed at all - this is just a change in information sharing arrangements.

They are not going to tax people selling one of their pins on eBay or selling their kids’ outgrown clothes on Vinted, because they are not trading.
 
My thinking here was the 30. Selling the odd thing on eBay probably won't take too long to get to 30.
 
Time to make a few Facebook profiles, using gmail addresses and using different accounts.

I do see on here, people who buy machines thru a business, claim tax relief and get the vat relief and sell them for 'cash' or bank transfer to a personal a/c.

Clearly this is to perhaps stop them type of traders.

FB do not really ask you for proper ID when opening an account. So I can see loads more being sold on Market place.
 
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